[azbackpackr]

Unit 1 is a good one.

[Jim Lyding]

I read David Quammen's book "Monster of God" a few years ago. It's about how humans interact with large and dangerous predators like Asiatic lions, saltwater crocodiles, and tigers. One of his main conclusions is that animals and other species of the same ilk need to be managed with the goals of not only preserving them, but letting local people benefit from them. Tourism is part of it, but so is hunting. People are more likely to protect animals that provide quantitative value to themselves. So much of wildlife conservation is qualitative, and very little is quantitative. At least that's how Quammen sees it.

Obviously the Mexican wolf population in the Southwest isn't ready to face pressure from legal hunting, but hopefully one day we'll see a wolf population that can sustain hunting because its population level is healthy. Liz has brought up how wolves provide quantifiable value by dispersing elk herds, and many of us have read how wolves in the northern Rockies have dramatically improved the ecosystem there. I'm not sure what it will take to educate the folks in the White Mountains about the value of wolves, but perhaps there needs to be more carrots because the sticks ain't working. People are shooting wolves despite facing a massive fine and possible jail time.

[Rob del Desierto]

Mexican Wolf found dead along highway:
http://azwmcl.org/blog/general/mexican- ... in-arizona

[azbackpackr]

Well, at least it appears to have been accidental, instead of murder.

[red dog]

Another gunshot loss.
This guy was a bit out of the recovery area.
http://www.beaumontenterprise.com/news/ ... 330105.php

[big_load]

[Jim_H]

It seems to me that the area of the wolf recovery is probably too small. Wolves by nature roamed around over vast areas looking for territory and mates, and we can't expect wolves to know our political boundaries that allow them to live in "safety". I think that unless a larger area into NM, AZ, and old Mexico is established, they are pretty much extinct.

[azbackpackr]

Pretty cool they would range as far as El Malpais. Very sad someone would shoot it. Hope they catch the person.

[Jim Lyding]

I am certain that if people stop shooting wolves, and the government stops trying to manage the population like it's in a zoo the wolves would spread far and wide. Wolves have a very high reproductive rate for a large carnivore, and can travel great distances. The wolf population in the northern Rockies in the U.S. is well over 1,000 individuals, and would undoubtedly be far higher if they weren't getting shot as well.

[Ckzona]

The wolves have been traveling far and well outside the range from what i've heard. I've read a few wolves have been spotted near Canyon Creek and one went all the way out to near Chevelon Creek. They definitely are going to travel outside of the recovery area and I wish all the idiots would stop killing them and i bet if we left them all alone within 10 years they would be all the way out to Flagstaff and down to the chiricahuas.

[sam_hikes]

heard 3 spent the winter around Greer and GMF have been keeping an eye on them.

also heard they can move great distances in a single day if req ( over 50 miles ) but they typically follow the elk.

no worries as when was the last deadly animal/hiker attack in AZ--very unlikely as even the big cats get tracked by NPS frequently in the GC along side the hikers.

[Rob del Desierto]

When I was working for the PFund, we'd occasionally pick up cougar collars on our sets. Pretty interesting. There was one cat that was actually crossing the river fairly frequently for a while.

[Ckzona]

I couldn't find it but I was reading a site about the wolves earlier and it showed a map showing that the wolves are allowed to roam basically from the new mexico border to the california border all along the Mogollon Rim and are only required to relocate them if they travel outside of the boundary. So basically the wolves are free to roam all over central Arizona and if they leave the boundary they are required to be relocate them back to the Blue Range area but the wolves are again free to roam wherever.

[azbackpackr]

To the California border? I had thought the main areas were supposed to be the Gila Wilderness in NM, the Blue Range, the Hannagan/Black River and Mt. Baldy areas, and then also over on the San Carlos and WM Apache reservations.

[Ckzona]

To the California border? I had thought the main areas were supposed to be the Gila Wilderness in NM, the Blue Range, the Hannagan/Black River and Mt. Baldy areas, and then also over on the San Carlos and WM Apache reservations.

Me too!! But i saw this map on some site about Mexican Wolfs and it showed a big ol green area where the wolves are allowed to roam from the New Mexican Border to the Californian Border. Ill try to find that link

Edit: So i couldn't find that link but found a similar map

http://www.fws.gov/southwest/es/mexican ... _map.shtml

IS the Experimental Population Area an area where the wolves can roam, is what I'm wondering.

[azbackpackr]

Interesting map! Thanks!

However, I used to live in the area, and know some of the players. I am pretty sure they are still trapping any of them that get out of the recovery area.

[Jim Lyding]

I'd love to see wolves all over the West, but I somehow doubt that they'll be allowed (or able) to establish a population that ranges from Parker, AZ to Las Cruces, NM.

[azbackpackr]

Over near Parker, in the Arrastra Wilderness, there are elk. Yes, really. No, I am not kidding, there are elk just east of Parker. So, why not wolves?

http://www.azgfd.gov/h_f/documents/OTC_ ... ntTips.pdf
http://www.blm.gov/az/st/en/prog/blm_sp ... astra.html

[RangerKelly]

Anyone know how the wolves are doing?

[azbackpackr]

Get on the AZGFD email list, they will send you an email update very regularly. I am not paying attention to that stuff right now. It is too contentious, for one thing. I am back in the White Mtns. and I don't want to think about it because then I would have to think about a lot of other stuff I don't want to think about right now. Right now I am getting ready to leave the US for 4 months...