[big_load]

What good would a compass do if they are in the wrong side canyon? The tonto runs east and west, the side canyons run north and south.

Getting into the wrong side canyon is one of the easiest mistakes to make and (I concede) can be tricky to work out with a compass, but I've done it. You need to take bearings off any feature you can possibly think of, down to the orientation of twists and turns or subsidiary side canyons, and relate them back to your hypothesized position. If you measured carefully and you're where you think you are, you'll have a match. When something doesn't line up right, you have to form a new hypothesis. I've also verified (and ruled out) a position by estimating the relative slope of walls at various points compared to the map.

[Rob del Desierto]

I don't understand how somebody can embark on a multi-day backpack trip without a GPS (and an extra set of batteries).

Simple. You just leave them at home or in your truck or don't even own one. GPS is a great tool, but it isn't perfect for everyone. I think everyone can agree here (it seems to be the case) that navigational devices and orienteering skills are essential for backcountry hiking. I think that what form those devices take is up to the individual hiker; map, gps, compass, any of the above. Whatever works for you in your hiking situation, as long as you know how to properly use it, should get the job done. There's no reason for anyone, either GPS or map/compass camp, to try and push their particular method of self-orienting on others - its an un-winnable proposition. People who like maps and compasses are unlikely to switch, and GPSers are equally unlikely to revert to map/compass hikers.

[Grasshopper]

There's no reason for anyone, either GPS or map/compass camp, to try and push their particular method of self-orienting on others - its an un-winnable proposition. People who like maps and compasses are unlikely to switch, and GPSers are equally unlikely to revert to map/compass hikers.

In my case, I originally learned with map(7.5 purchased topo) and a compass. While living In southern CALIF I would take refresher orienting courses every 2 years. This was a number of years ago. Now I can't remember when the last time I purchased a 7.5 topo to use for the area I was planning to hike.. I think mainly due to the now increased costs and the lack of local, convenient availability of topo's. I still always take various maps and my compass on all my dayhikes- remote and otherwise, but in all honesty I really question how much they will help me in a dire situation due to my present "rusty" orienting skills and not having an official 7.5 topo to orient-ire on. Since hiking in AZ over the past four years, I can think of at least 3-4 remote dayhikes I have been on that were turning bad (due too loss of trail, route finding problems, loss of daylight, etc..). In all these cases, my hiking partners GPS unit with my maps got us out safely later that day/night.

For me, I have decided that my maps, a new GPS unit (and a commitment to learn how to use it correctly), and a compass will now be part of my essential backcountry hiking. I took the plunge last night and purchased that new Garmin 60CSx GPS unit with accessories. In my mind, the more safety devices the better.. things can and do go wrong in the wilderness: "never say never & never assume anything"!!

[nonot]

Having a compass only helps so much if the forest service maps are so horrible that they would have you go in the wrong direction. A perfect example is the hike we went on today. I printed out and brought the FS map. Both my compass and my GPS said we were going in a different direction than the map. Thankfully I don't trust all maps I didn't produce myself

[big_load]

Yeah, those FS maps can be really frustrating. I find them more useful for knowing the numbers of FS road. Note that I didn't say useful for planning travel on FS roads, because they don't generally distinguish well between jeep tracks and smooth gravel roads.

[Rob del Desierto]

Yeah, those FS maps can be really frustrating. I find them more useful for knowing the numbers of FS road. Note that I didn't say useful for planning travel on FS roads, because they don't generally distinguish well between jeep tracks and smooth gravel roads.

That's if you're lucky enough to have the road you're traveling on even listed. All my FS maps have my own additions and corrections on them.

[jeffmacewen]

A couple of folks said it, but it can't be overstated: Learn land navigation and keep those skill sharp!!

This is especially true of you're going out on multi-day, remote hikes without the assistance of technology. Trip planning is critical, too. Breaking longer hikes into legs with prominent "milestones" and way-points sets you up for success. It looks like they pretty much set themselves up for failure...