[Outdoor Lover]

@kingsnake No takers on that front, but I did get a few offers to help carry the load....I don't think any of my compadres were French though! By the way, I never did get to see the Photoset of the pics when I unloaded at the top! Who's camera was that anyway????

@kevinweitzel75 You take a lawn chair on a day hike? Although I have been accused of carrying the "kitchen sink" before, even though it wasn't true, it just looked like it. That's what you get for deciding to host a New Year's Party on a Peak!

My typical "daypack" weight is somewhere between 15 and 20 lbs. I have to carry alot of water, because I have to drink alot or I start getting sick even in winter. I took 5 liters to the top of Capitol Butte and used 3 1/2 of it....It is helpful though, for me to carry a heavier pack, especially on those hikes that require alot of scrambling, climbing etc. Because now I know that I can do those hikes with a heavier pack and I won't be in total physical shock when I start backpacking....

@Grasshopper No grief from me. I pack for the worst case scenario every time and count on being alone when it happens, even when I'm hiking with someone else....I'm slow enough on uphills that sometimes even in a group I can be alone for a stretch, which is fine with me, and I'm comfortable knowing that if something happens, even then, I'm prepared, if not to help myself, to help someone else if need be....

[Grasshopper]

This recent HAZ article by Al_HikesAZ - "Best Wilderness Survival tips?" http://hikearizona.com/article.php?ID=34&O=0 should rightfully be added to this forum thread.. The best tip for any survival situation is "Be Prepared". Know what to do to stay out of survival situations. Possess the skills and carry the tools to deal with survival situations. Once you are in a survival situation, your survival will depend on your preparedness - both your physical and mental preparedness. Let's look first at Mental Preparedness because it is the most important and then at Physical Preparedness.

[WilliamnWendi]

@Grasshopper Agreed, Wendi has her own kit. It has iodine, first aid, matches, multi-tool, whistle with compass(ehh?), mace(not bear), jacket, poncho, socks, rain-pants. Now whether she knows how to use everything? She's pretty smart, iodine has got instructions(Probably need to refresh that item in both our kits). Probably should get her a real compass, and supply her with her own topos. Upgrade the compass.
I carry all of the same plus umbrella, filtration(when expecting a source), oh and we both carry Bug Hats (She hates buggy bugs), expanded first aid, expanded fire starting , we both carry flashlights but I carry additional, zertec, benedryl, we both carry multiple bandanas, we both carry rock climbing gloves, I carry garden gloves, pruners, camera, gps. Will be adding a fire-arm soon, especially as adventures beginning to get more mileage.

[Sredfield]

Check out this article on survival:

http://www.phoenixmag.com/lifestyle/thi ... --arizona/

[Grasshopper]

Check out this article on survival:

http://www.phoenixmag.com/lifestyle/thi ... --arizona/

Shawn, thanks for posting this timely article link.
"Tinder: Nester’s pyro-centric secret weapon? Petroleum jelly-smeared cotton balls. He massages about a teaspoon of Vaseline into each cotton ball, then stuffs them into a cylindrical plastic matchbox. These babies ignite even in damp or snowy conditions." Now this is a new one I had never heard of and makes good sense too.
"Signaling Mirror: Like a compact mirror but with a sighting device, these mirrors allow you to aim a beam of light at the search and rescue volunteer or airplane looking for you." I need to find and buy one of these.
"Electrolyte replacement solution: Chugging water but not replacing your sodium and potassium can be just as deadly as heat stroke..so electrolyte replacement- e.g.- Vitalyte electrolyte replacement packets".
"Fire starters: Nester advises triple-preparation: storm-proof matches, a spark rod and a lighter. His favorite? The spark rod, which has about 500 fires in it and works when wet. Plus, he says, “[Striking it] is a gross motor skill, which is what you are going to be reduced to when you’re hypothermic.” Matches, on the other hand, are difficult to strike when you’re hypothermically ham-fisted, and matchboxes contain only about 25 storm-proof matches with a shelf-life of about two years. Cigarette lighters tend to conk out above 10,000 feet." I have not replaced my emergency kit storm-proof matches in probably 10 years

[Outdoor Lover]

mace(not bear),

So what's the mace for? It only works on humans and the "mace" that you buy to put on your keychain is pretty weak stuff. If it's for personal protection from other people than go to a good uniform or spy shop and get Pepper Spray with oleoresin capsicum. I have other recommendations as well about it, you can PM me. But it is important to understand that if you have no training and find yourself in a situation where you need to use it, better make sure which way the wind is blowing or you end up incapacitating yourself....And forget about it stopping any wildlife that has a mindset.....

Carrying a compass is a must, if for no other reason that knowing your directions. But I can also tell you that an Orienteering course is an awesome thing and really shows you how to get the most use out of your compass. It's also alot of fun to learn. I actually need to take a refresher course, it's been a long time since I have had to use one and I forget some of the logistics. But a compass and a good map are as good and sometimes better than a GPS, since you don't have to rely on a signal and batteries....

Awesome articles on Survival guys. Love the cotton ball idea and I have toyed with buying a striker/flint before I even read these. The Striker Rod sounds great. My biggest foopah is I wear cotton, simply for budget reasons right now and I don't carry electrolytes. Haven't found a good mix that tastes good and if it doesn't taste good I won't drink much. Need to start carrying powdered gatorade probably, if nothing else. I carried bleach when in New Orleans, learned that one in basic first aid, but you really have to carry something to cut the taste as well. The nice thing about it is that it works pretty quick, no waiting like with purification tablets....

[WilliamnWendi]

"Tinder: Nester’s pyro-centric secret weapon? Petroleum jelly-smeared cotton balls. He massages about a teaspoon of Vaseline into each cotton ball, then stuffs them into a cylindrical plastic matchbox. These babies ignite even in damp or snowy conditions." Now this is a new one I had never heard of and makes good sense too.

I actually carry dryer lint and chapstick (in place of petroleum jelly) as part of my extended fire kit. I also carry the obligatory magnesium and flint.

"Electrolyte replacement solution: Chugging water but not replacing your sodium and potassium can be just as deadly as heat stroke..so electrolyte replacement- e.g.- Vitalyte electrolyte replacement packets".

This is also part of both our kits, as well jerky that is kept in reserve. I also keep heavy gauge aluminum foil for bowl making to boil water if needed.(That's something I should have in Wendi's kit, she doesn't currently have any way to boil water)
I didn't read the article yet but I assume that that is Tony Nester, he's a favorite of mine. There are of course a ridiculous amount of survival videos on YouTube. I used to watch Dave Campbell's (from Ohio, my home state) videos on You Tube all the time until he had to cut his ties for his Discovery Channel show "Dual Survivor" with Cody Lundin (Prescott) who I actually hadn't heard of. Of course there is alway Les Stroud, my personal favorite. I don't watch Bear Gryll's though, please don't let me get stuck in a survival situation with him! Silly for some but for city boys, this one way to get some knowledge, of course putting that knowledge too work is what really counts. Getting caught unawares and unprepared on South Mountain a couple years ago got me started learning every thing I could about being prepared.

[WilliamnWendi]

o what's the mace for? It only works on humans and the "mace" that you buy to put on your keychain is pretty weak stuff. If it's for personal protection from other people than go to a good uniform or spy shop and get Pepper Spray with oleoresin capsicum. I have other recommendations as well about it, you can PM me. But it is important to understand that if you have no training and find yourself in a situation where you need to use it, better make sure which way the wind is blowing or you end up incapacitating yourself....And forget about it stopping any wildlife that has a mindset.....

I am aware of that, and she is aware of that this is not Bear Spray and why I specified that in my earlier post, it is for Bi-peds (again don't assume what will happen, prepare for what might). We've both gone over it's capabilities, and she knows not to spray into the wind. It is oleoresin capsicum. I think I read somewhere, on HAZ perhaps, that once dry these sprays actually might attract Bears. My pack is always evolving so by all means any recommendations are welcome.

There are a lot of interesting orienteering tutorials on the web, I have read through a lot of them. There is of course room for improvement. I am not cutting the azimuth so to speak.

Yeah I think Wendi would drink muddy water before she would some of the electrolyte mixes.

[Outdoor Lover]

I think I read somewhere, on HAZ perhaps, that once dry these sprays actually might attract Bears. My pack is always evolving so by all means any recommendations are welcome.

I don't know about that, haven't read any studies about that. Not sure what to think other than it is derived from a food based substance, but in a sealed container and the minute amount, I might question it. I don't know why they market "Bear Spray" it's just a large Pepper Spray and it will work about as well on a serious Bear about like it works on a serious Dog. It won't. It will only work on "Bluffers" and only because it's the "sound" and action of something coming at them that makes them take pause, not the actual ingredients itself. A can of spray paint will have just as much effect...Animals don't have the same sinus system and tear ducts as we humans do, so it will not incapacitate an animal like it does a person. I don't carry Pepper Spray on my belt for the Dogs, I carry it for the Dog Owners....

If Wendy is a good aim and you want her to continue carrying it, I would recommend a Stream spray instead of a mist. It has a longer range and the wind will be less of an issue. The only drawback is that you have to be more accurate and you aim for the chest, not the eyes.

Like you, I intend at some point to just start packing a firearm. And not just for bears or out of control humans. There is Rabies out there and any medium to large animal can pose a threat if it's sick, even if the animal is normally a harmless species....Just try to remember, even in the heat of an attack, if you have any hope of getting the animal tested to avoid the Rabies shots, don't shoot it in the head....

Of course I also don't really recommend the flip side, although it was kinda smart on the woman's part. She grabbed the "attached" fox? I think? and walked back to her car with it still attached to her arm and somehow got her trunk open and managed to extricate the animal and throw it in the trunk and trap it in there. Would not have wanted to be the poor sucker that had to find a way to remove the rabid animal very much still alive from the trunk of the car....That took some serious brass ones on both their parts....

[WilliamnWendi]

There is Rabies out there and any medium to large animal can pose a threat if it's sick, even if the animal is normally a harmless species....Just try to remember, even in the heat of an attack, if you have any hope of getting the animal tested to avoid the Rabies shots, don't shoot it in the head....

We have a friend who had to put a coyote down because of that. I have heard that you can get rabies from brain matter and bone marrow. If you have had contact do not rub your eyes, do not consume the animal.

[Outdoor Lover]

@WilliamnWendi We're getting off topic a bit, but I'll check my notes from training and get back to you on what you heard, that may not quite be the case. I'll forum shop and post some Rabies facts....

[DBmooner]

you all will probly laught at me but i always carry a couple Chem lights with me as a back up light . i have been lucky enought to never need it but ran into a guy at west clear creek who was late geting back to came and the sun was going down and he still had miles to his camp and all he had was a water bottel and now my glow stick he never made it back to his camp but the glow stick left him see through the night . i saw him on the way out and he said he was so happy to have it cause it was the only light he had all night till his friends found him in the morning.

[kevinweitzel75]

Essentials.... back to another thread... my Glock 23. I know, I know. But you never really know when you might need something like that. Always be prepared for ANYTHING. That's what I was taught. I have never needed it, and hope I never will. Back to basics, a small first aid kit, duct tape, a compass, flint and steel, a bic lighter, extra alcohol pads (fire making), gerber multi tool with a VERY sharp knife (thanks to 127 Hours), water tablets and a bandanna. That's every pack, every time no mater where I'm hiking. After reading this thread, I will be adding a couple more items, I think.

[allanalxndr]

These would make a nice addition to our packs. http://www.uvpaqlite.com/
Last a lifetime, cheap, reuseable.

[PLC92084]

I've been carrying most of the stuff mentioned here for years... I've recently changed my signal mirror (which broke into several pieces on my last Royal Arch trip - the glass shards (sherds!?) were a little distracting). I'm now experimenting with several old hard-drive platters. They're highly reflective (though not quite as good as a true mirror), unbreakable, and have a center hole for aiming/signaling. It works well as a camp mirror too! So far, results are pretty positive. Best thing, it didn't cost me anything; I simply dissected one of the many dead hard drives I have laying around...

[kingsnake]

After yesterday, I am thinking a SAM Splint and a bag of hemoglobin would not be amiss ...

[WilliamnWendi]

@allanalxndrThat's pretty cool, might have to add the 6x8

[hikeaz]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNbLNP6h5zQ

[SuperstitionGuy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNbLNP6h5zQ

Thanks Gene and hikeaz.

Did anyone notice? Gene was wearing blue jeans! My favorite also as I bust through catclaw. And that shirt looked like it was or consisted of lots of cotton. Long sleeve with two front button down pockets.

And the first mention of parachute cord on this thread! Amazing.....

Something that should have been mentioned as a first item to carry in your survival kit!

[hikeaz]

One very important item is also the knowledge and skill to USE any and all of these items. As we all know from other aspects of our lives; practice makes perfect, so trying out all this gear before its use is required is key. And with this practice and the confidence it instills, we will be more able to keep a level head when a 'situation' arises, avoiding panic and the poor decisions it produces.