44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Day Hiking & general trail related

Moderator: HAZ - Moderators

Linked Guides none
Linked Areas none
User avatar
skatchkins
Posts: 293
Joined: Dec 22 2007 8:08 pm
City, State: Mesa, AZ
Contact:

44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by skatchkins » Aug 23 2019 2:23 pm

May he guide you through the wilderness : protect you through the storm;
May he bring you home rejoicing : at the wonders he has shown you;
Armchair Crisis Design

User avatar
chumley
Posts: 7015
Joined: Sep 18 2002 8:59 am
City, State: Tempe, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by chumley » Aug 23 2019 2:36 pm

@skatchkins
It's correct. Sort of.

It was a group of 44 from Kansas. I believe only 2 of them took the helicopter option down, while SAR personnel "guided" the others back down under their own power.
https://www.azfamily.com/news/hikers-fr ... 35227.html
Profound observer

User avatar
ALMAL
Posts: 195
Joined: Oct 17 2010 8:02 pm
City, State: GILBERT

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by ALMAL » Aug 23 2019 2:40 pm

@skatchkins
Another source says they were all the same group from Kansas. Several of them tried clicking their heels together 3 times, but nothing happened, so they called for rescue.
You aren't late if you don't show up!

User avatar
chumley
Posts: 7015
Joined: Sep 18 2002 8:59 am
City, State: Tempe, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by chumley » Aug 23 2019 3:08 pm

Way to go Minneapolis!! By far the most detailed news article I've seen so far!
http://www.startribune.com/dozens-of-to ... 558021392/
Profound observer

User avatar
skatchkins
Posts: 293
Joined: Dec 22 2007 8:08 pm
City, State: Mesa, AZ
Contact:

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by skatchkins » Aug 23 2019 9:55 pm

Fitness coordinators lol.
May he guide you through the wilderness : protect you through the storm;
May he bring you home rejoicing : at the wonders he has shown you;
Armchair Crisis Design

User avatar
AZLumberjack
Posts: 314
Joined: Feb 17 2010 10:28 am
City, State: Apache Junction, AZ.
Contact:

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by AZLumberjack » Aug 24 2019 6:36 am

I drove out to the LDSP to talk with the source but that was a waste of time as she said she couldn't release any details... "Watch it on the news".
On every trip into the Superstitions, I find another Gold Mine. Today the mine was filled with Memories. I can not wait for the next trip.

User avatar
skatchkins
Posts: 293
Joined: Dec 22 2007 8:08 pm
City, State: Mesa, AZ
Contact:

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by skatchkins » Aug 24 2019 10:44 am

Kansas_SAR.jpg
Good movie
May he guide you through the wilderness : protect you through the storm;
May he bring you home rejoicing : at the wonders he has shown you;
Armchair Crisis Design

User avatar
wildwesthikes
Posts: 44
Joined: Nov 23 2010 9:41 am
City, State: Phoenix, AZ
Contact:

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by wildwesthikes » Aug 24 2019 5:32 pm

We aren't in Kansas any more...

User avatar
Nighthiker
Posts: 1444
Joined: Feb 03 2002 6:59 am
City, State: Payson

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by Nighthiker » Aug 24 2019 7:35 pm

Another example of people doing things in a group that otherwise would not do by themselves.
jk

User avatar
DarthStiller
Posts: 873
Joined: Jul 05 2006 12:36 pm
City, State: Mesa, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by DarthStiller » Aug 25 2019 7:28 am

So at some point these people must have left LDSP and crossed the boundary into the wilderness. Shouldn't the 15 person limit come into play somewhere? Looks the priority of that rule is very low.

no avatar
DixieFlyer
Posts: 132
Joined: Jan 07 2017 7:03 am
City, State: Fountain Hills, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by DixieFlyer » Aug 25 2019 12:17 pm

DarthStiller wrote:
Aug 25 2019 7:28 am
So at some point these people must have left LDSP and crossed the boundary into the wilderness. Shouldn't the 15 person limit come into play somewhere? Looks the priority of that rule is very low.
If they went all the way to Siphon Draw they would definitely be in the Superstition Wilderness
I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of starvation.

User avatar
AZLumberjack
Posts: 314
Joined: Feb 17 2010 10:28 am
City, State: Apache Junction, AZ.
Contact:

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by AZLumberjack » Aug 26 2019 7:22 am

DarthStiller wrote:So at some point these people must have left LDSP and crossed the boundary into the wilderness. Shouldn't the 15 person limit come into play somewhere? Looks the priority of that rule is very low.
The FS personnel at the entrance to the park don't seem to care about the group size limitations, after all, there's money to be made.
On every trip into the Superstitions, I find another Gold Mine. Today the mine was filled with Memories. I can not wait for the next trip.

User avatar
chumley
Posts: 7015
Joined: Sep 18 2002 8:59 am
City, State: Tempe, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by chumley » Aug 26 2019 7:59 am

@AZLumberjack
The FS makes no money from people entering the forest or Superstition Wilderness. It would be nice if they educated visitors and enforced the rules.
Profound observer

User avatar
SuperstitionGuy
Posts: 1572
Joined: Dec 25 2005 8:24 pm
City, State: Apache Junction, Arizona

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by SuperstitionGuy » Aug 26 2019 9:12 am

It's a State Park and I don't think the U.S.Forest Service has anything to say who enters the park.
Actually are they even there? :-k
A man's body may grow old, but inside his spirit can still be as young and restless as ever.
- Garth McCann from the movie Second Hand Lions

Another victim of Pixel Trivia.

Current avatar courtesy of Snakemarks

User avatar
ALMAL
Posts: 195
Joined: Oct 17 2010 8:02 pm
City, State: GILBERT

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by ALMAL » Aug 26 2019 11:36 am

@chumley
I was on the Mormon trail Saturday morning and on the way back down a heard a lady go off on another lady for short-cutting the trail. I thought maybe she was employed by the FS. Another hiker defended the woman saying the trail has many splinters and it's hard to tell which is the actual trail. All of them were blocking the trail to argue so I had to step off the trail to pass, ooops. I was waiting for a response but nothing.
You aren't late if you don't show up!

User avatar
Tough_Boots
Posts: 1745
Joined: Mar 28 2008 7:08 pm
City, State: Phoenix, AZ
Contact:

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by Tough_Boots » Aug 26 2019 11:44 am

SuperstitionGuy wrote:It's a State Park and I don't think the U.S.Forest Service has anything to say who enters the park.
Siphon Draw is in federal wilderness outside of the park.
"there is no love where there is no bramble."
--bill callahan

User avatar
sajor75
Posts: 83
Joined: Dec 26 2015 12:59 pm
City, State: Phoenix

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by sajor75 » Aug 26 2019 1:13 pm

You would thunk that out of the 44 one of them would have common sense and know their capabilities.

User avatar
DarthStiller
Posts: 873
Joined: Jul 05 2006 12:36 pm
City, State: Mesa, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by DarthStiller » Aug 26 2019 1:37 pm

@AZLumberjack
I wouldn't expect them to stop a large group. My point is that, once it's brought all the attention from being in rescue mode, it would seem reasonable that it might at least be brought up that by the way, your group is also beyond the legal size limit in the wilderness area you deliberately entered. Or maybe the FS would give some guff to the LDSP staff for allowing a group that large once they told them what they were going to do, hot weather or not. It doesn't surprise me that it hasn't been brought up, though. The 15 person limit has been debated here before, I think this almost gives credit to the idea that it's not a priority. Maybe considered outdated or irrelevant now? Was this originally for restricting mining activity and the like?

User avatar
chumley
Posts: 7015
Joined: Sep 18 2002 8:59 am
City, State: Tempe, AZ

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by chumley » Aug 26 2019 2:55 pm

@DarthStiller
I think it's probably just not a priority for the FS and their limited resources. But they do try to pass the responsibility on to the user. I wish this would be emphasized more.
To avoid over-regulation, wilderness management must rely on the wilderness user to assume the responsibility to practice appropriate back country techniques. For example, large groups are particularly disruptive to the quality of solitude. Even day use by large groups (15 and over) can sharply reduce other users' solitude.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/tonto/sp ... rdb5163403
Profound observer

User avatar
trekkin_gecko
Posts: 535
Joined: Nov 17 2008 4:30 pm
City, State: phoenix, az

Re: 44? Hikers Rescued from Lost Dutchman State Park Overnight

Post by trekkin_gecko » Aug 26 2019 2:58 pm

I would like to see some follow up on this story

Post Reply

Return to “Trail Chat”


cron