Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

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Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Dschur » Nov 16 2010 2:04 pm

Hike Arizona urges anyone interested in searching to post or join an event.

If you go out, please track your hike on a GPS and post it for the benefit of future searches. Simply post it upon return. (if you need help ask the webmaster) Hike Arizona will see that it gets linked to a master map. If you have multiple variations in your group, please post all tracks. As more info is posted the map will evolve and the overlaps will be removed.

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Crews looking for missing hiker
By Alexis Bechman

November 16, 2010
Tonto Rim Search and Rescue volunteers and Gila County Sheriff officers are currently searching for an overdue hiker.

The man, whose name has not been released, was last heard from nine days ago and is believed to be hiking near the Mt. Peeley trail or Sheep Mountain, off Forest Road 201, southwest of Payson.

The Gila County Sheriff’s Office first received a call that the man was overdue Monday, Nov. 15 about 9 p.m.

“The hiker has not been heard from since Nov. 7 and frequents the Mazatzal Mountain Wilderness area,” according to a press release from the sheriff’s office.

The missing hiker’s vehicle was located at the Mt. Peeley trailhead.



Six TRSAR volunteers are currently searching the ground. Earlier Tuesday, a Department of Public Safety Ranger helicopter did an aerial search of the area, but found no signs of the man
Dawn
--On the loose to climb a mountain, on the loose where I am free. On the loose to live my life the way I think my life should be...For we only have a moment and a whole world yet to see...I'll be looking for tomorrow on the loose. ---unknown--

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Tough_Boots » Nov 30 2010 12:40 pm

jeffmacewen wrote:I don't want to start a firestorm but I think it is in incredibly poor taste to advertise a for-profit class on this thread.
CAMRA is a non-profit who's purpose is to rescue people like us. I OK with it even though I unfortunately can't afford it.
"there is no love where there is no bramble."
--bill callahan

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Jeffshadows » Nov 30 2010 4:18 pm

juliachaos wrote:@jeffmacewen
It's okay, we asked him to provide us with that information earlier on in this really long thread :)
I beg your pardon, everyone. I missed that part...
AD-AVGVSTA-PER-ANGVSTA

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Grasshopper » Nov 30 2010 7:54 pm

For those of us now planning our organized group and individual ongoing search efforts I thought it a good idea FOR US ALL TO AGAIN READ these previous and most important posts by David Bremson- Central Arizona Mountain Rescue Association:
MtnResq30 wrote:by MtnResq30 » Nov 25 2010 12:23 pm
Clues:
Please consider the reliability of each clue before sending it though. Often we will receive reports of items that are clearly not associated with the missing subject, i.e., a pair of glasses that have clearly been in the field for years, old food cans, shoes, whatever.
MtnResq30 wrote:by MtnResq30 » Nov 24 2010 6:49 pm
Remember, there are more many clues and only one GPSJoe. Look for clues such as a debris field (hat, pack, hiking poles, glasses) in areas where a fall may have been possible.
MtnResq30 wrote:by MtnResq30 » Nov 24 2010 1:49 pm
HAZ:
I have received a number of requests to post the segments that Mountain Rescue has searched during the mission to locate Mr. Domin. Perhaps I can provide some insight based upon the information that you all have posted over the last week.
As many of you have discovered, this area presents considerable challenges to the hiker and the searcher. As a hiker, this area is rugged, steep and unless you stay on the limited trails, is wrought with inhospitable terrain and brutal vegetation. To the searcher, the environmental complexity grows exponentially as this requires operating at a high level to travel safely while being an effective search resource. A job easier said than done.
The posts in this forum have been impressive and, for many, quite accurate. Many of you have made many relatively accurate assumptions regarding his probable intentions and his probably route. These are accurate only if your assumptions correctly identified his probable intentions and his probable route. Since his situation was discovered by a concerned friend several days after his hike began, this is the only information that you have to commence solving the classic mystery of searching for a lost person.
When searching for someone who is most likely immobile and unresponsive the rule of probability continues. We have been asked to provide information regarding where we searched, but knowing this specific area is truly of little value as you continue to search. Allow me to decipher the meaning of that statement. Because no one knows for certain where Mr. Domin intended to hike, nor the specific route he intended to hike, an assumption must be based on the information that you have, which is the GPS data and forum posts from previous hikes. If he was unsuccessful in reaching his goal by way of these previous routes, it is probable that he intended to hike another route, or perhaps, hike a completely different trail. Which do you choose? Let’s say that you decide that he made another go for Sheep Mountain, you can determine the route/area with the highest probability because you know that some areas are less probable than others and you can’t search them all due to terrain and vegetation. Now you have determined what we call PoA, or Probability of Area. Next, you must determine the likelihood of actually finding a clue, or finding Mr. Domin, in a certain area. This is PoD or Probability of Detection. For those who have actually been in the area, based upon your comments in this forum, you have determined that it is very challenging to see anything in the Manzanita and on the slopes of the mountain, thus the PoD is very low. To know where we have searched may lead you to believe that there was a high PoD and that Mr. Domin is certainly not there. You also know that to increase your probability you must increase your number of repetitions. If I want to flip a coin and get “heads” 10 times, I know, based upon probability, that I must flip it at least 10 times, but more likely 20 times. There is also the probability that it will take 40 flips. There is also the probability that it could land on its side or never come down. Translation – Mr. Domin could be outside of your probable search area. The probability is low, but it does exist. In reality, you could search an area and be standing right next to, or on top of, a clue and never know it. If you continued, you would think that you have searched an area and that the clue is not there. How many times have you searched for something as easy to find as your car keys, going back to the same location several times and then finally finding them? They did not move, you just did not recognize the clue because of other factors. My point, finding Mr. Domin is challenging, and in reality, may not be a solvable situation. However, the probability also exists that one of you, or Mountain Rescue or TRSAR will find him.
I also wanted to touch on a couple of side topics that were discussed in the forum. One is the use of SPOT or PLB’s while traveling in the backcountry. Many limitations were identified, yet even with these limitations it is my personal opinion that the benefits far outweigh the limitations. Personally, I do not travel in to the backcountry without a SPOT. I find it a useful tool to let my friends and family know that I am ok during a trip and also can ask for assistance if I find myself in a situation that I can’t solve. Anyone could break an ankle or have something else happen. In the backcountry, little problems quickly become big problems and can have a significant impact on your life. Being able to ask for help, when appropriate, can truly be the difference between life and death.
The next topic addresses self-sufficiency in the backcountry. As I mentioned, even a small issue can grow to a big one when in the mountains. The question, how many of you have taken a Wilderness First Aid or Wilderness First Responder class? If you have not, I highly recommend this training. Mountain Rescue offers course throughout the year and could even coordinate a class specific to HAZ.
Finally, I am truly impressed by the concern for Mr. Domin. Your desire to bring him home is amazing and I wish that everyone would put the same energy in to their respective communities. As you continue to search, please remember that your safety should be your primary concern. Don’t let emotion reign over good judgment and sound decision making. Mr. Domin was a very experienced backcountry hiker, proving that anything can happen, even to those with a lot of experience and knowledge. Be sure to file a flight plan before you head out, even on a day hike. Tell someone where you are going, when you will return and don’t deviate from your plan. I have been a backcountry user for 30 plus years, have climbed all over the world and still follow this rule. One day it will save my life.
Respectfully,
David Bremson
Central Arizona Mountain Rescue Association
(Outside.. "there is No Place Like It!!")

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Randal_Schulhauser » Nov 30 2010 8:04 pm

Be sure to file a flight plan before you head out, even on a day hike. Tell someone where you are going, when you will return and don’t deviate from your plan. I have been a backcountry user for 30 plus years, have climbed all over the world and still follow this rule. One day it will save my life.
Respectfully,
David Bremson
Central Arizona Mountain Rescue Association



AMEN! : app :

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by PrestonSands » Nov 30 2010 8:09 pm

Has anyone been up FR 201 to the Mount Peeley trailhead since Sunday's storm? If so, is there much snow on the road?
"I'm going for a coffee, but you never know when a hike might break out." -Jim Gaffigan

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by suzaz » Dec 01 2010 5:36 am

http://hikearizona.com/location_g.php?QX=167
This is very cool, thank you for doing this route with pictures!

Hank---I finally got to sit down and view what you sent. (probably just after joe got the new link up :( ) I've attached a jpeg of what you sent me in this post because others have asked. Hope that's okay. Anything off the ridgeline is easier and faster traveling, for sure. I really liked that north side, too. Can anyone figure out how long it took Joe to reach the way point at the tip of that loop near picture #16? Would he have thought he had enough time if he now had the direct route already marked. Did I miss the discussion about why we think he did a loop instead of following his exact track back.....again still searching?

It sounds like people are going out to walk this little loop section soon, is that correct? Joe didn't name this file LAST CHANCE, right?

Does anyone know what Joe had delivered in that 3 day express package that GB found at the doorstep? Was it hiking related?
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by SUN_HIKER » Dec 01 2010 8:52 am

suzaz wrote:http://hikearizona.com/location_g.php?QX=167
This is very cool, thank you for doing this route with pictures!

Hank---I finally got to sit down and view what you sent. (probably just after joe got the new link up :( ) I've attached a jpeg of what you sent me in this post because others have asked. Hope that's okay. Anything off the ridgeline is easier and faster traveling, for sure. I really liked that north side, too. Can anyone figure out how long it took Joe to reach the way point at the tip of that loop near picture #16? Would he have thought he had enough time if he now had the direct route already marked. Did I miss the discussion about why we think he did a loop instead of following his exact track back.....again still searching?

It sounds like people are going out to walk this little loop section soon, is that correct? Joe didn't name this file LAST CHANCE, right?

Does anyone know what Joe had delivered in that 3 day express package that GB found at the doorstep? Was it hiking related?
Yes, we do know what was inside the package.
From Peeley TH to that approx. pict#16 it took Joe 4 1/2 hrs. He started at the TH at 8:53AM and came out at 5:43PM
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by BobP » Dec 01 2010 9:09 am

suzaz wrote:It sounds like people are going out to walk this little loop section soon, is that correct?
We hiked that area on 11/19...the loop section from one end of the loop to the other was about 500 ft. We took the wide angle on the way out and cut thru middle on the way back... some stayed high others lower. Friday we plan on doing it again and going further on the last chance route.
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by thebrayer » Dec 01 2010 4:57 pm

I'm just back from the Peeley trailhead. The road in was icy and had snow on it. How ever there was a white four door All wheel drive suburu hatchback at the trailhead. I finished my search around the trailhead to the Southeast. Has anyone gone down the old road to THicket Spring. IT's up on top of the hill I searched today and I didn't see any flags or any evidence on that trail. It's a fairly wide trail doing to it being the old road down the hill.

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Grasshopper » Dec 01 2010 5:08 pm

thebrayer wrote: Has anyone gone down the old road to THicket Spring. IT's up on top of the hill I searched today and I didn't see any flags or any evidence on that trail. It's a fairly wide trail doing to it being the old road down the hill.
There was some discussion a few days back for a needed search on this old road, but I have not seen any confirmation(s) of anyone who has actually hiked it from Peeley TH to ~Thicket Springs.. This might me a good option search route for someone planning on going up to help but not able to deal with the more serious off-tail bushwhacking required by most the other primary off trail search routes.. Thanks!
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by SUN_HIKER » Dec 01 2010 5:56 pm

thebrayer wrote:I'm just back from the Peeley trailhead. The road in was icy and had snow on it. How ever there was a white four door All wheel drive suburu hatchback at the trailhead. I finished my search around the trailhead to the Southeast. Has anyone gone down the old road to THicket Spring. IT's up on top of the hill I searched today and I didn't see any flags or any evidence on that trail. It's a fairly wide trail doing to it being the old road down the hill.
The day we had SAR out I went to Peeley TH. It was rough... saw Joe's 4 runner waiting for his owner... I noticed, there was that same all wheel drive white subaru.
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by PrestonSands » Dec 01 2010 8:33 pm

thebrayer wrote:I'm just back from the Peeley trailhead. The road in was icy and had snow on it. How ever there was a white four door All wheel drive suburu hatchback at the trailhead. I finished my search around the trailhead to the Southeast. Has anyone gone down the old road to THicket Spring. IT's up on top of the hill I searched today and I didn't see any flags or any evidence on that trail. It's a fairly wide trail doing to it being the old road down the hill.
Thanks for the road report. How far up does the snow start? Was it very deep?
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by Sredfield » Dec 01 2010 10:36 pm

SUN_HIKER wrote:
thebrayer wrote:I'm just back from the Peeley trailhead. The road in was icy and had snow on it. How ever there was a white four door All wheel drive suburu hatchback at the trailhead. I finished my search around the trailhead to the Southeast. Has anyone gone down the old road to THicket Spring. IT's up on top of the hill I searched today and I didn't see any flags or any evidence on that trail. It's a fairly wide trail doing to it being the old road down the hill.
The day we had SAR out I went to Peeley TH. It was rough... saw Joe's 4 runner waiting for his owner... I noticed, there was that same all wheel drive white subaru.
When this all started, I sent a note to some guys I knew were doing maintenance on the AZT during the time Joe was missing but no one knew. They were aware of another fellow in the area, and called the information in to the sheriff's office, and then talked to a deputy who had Joe's picture. The guy they saw was not Joe. Don't know if this other guy is the white Subaru or not, but it was an early lead that when checked out led no where.
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by oldguy » Dec 01 2010 11:15 pm

That was my Subaru at the Mt.Peeley trailhead today; I was clearing brush on the Arizona Trail again. Still about one inch of snow in some shady spots but
melting/sublimating fast. It should be no problem for even a two-wheel drive car.

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by PrestonSands » Dec 02 2010 12:02 am

oldguy wrote:That was my Subaru at the Mt.Peeley trailhead today; I was clearing brush on the Arizona Trail again. Still about one inch of snow in some shady spots but
melting/sublimating fast. It should be no problem for even a two-wheel drive car.
Great, thanks!
"I'm going for a coffee, but you never know when a hike might break out." -Jim Gaffigan

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by suzaz » Dec 02 2010 5:04 am

Oh Art good to see you. Welcome to the site.

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by BobP » Dec 02 2010 6:00 am

@Sredfield
It may have been Richard(mazatzal backwards) he was out there on the Nov 12th and talked to some AZT trail maintenance guys.
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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by suzaz » Dec 02 2010 6:44 am

oldguy wrote:That was my Subaru at the Mt.Peeley trailhead today; I was clearing brush on the Arizona Trail again. Still about one inch of snow in some shady spots but melting/sublimating fast. It should be no problem for even a two-wheel drive car.
Hey Art, I remember you mentioning that you actually met GPSjoe out in the Mt. Peeley area on a few occasions over the last year. Can you remember where you were when you met him? I'm thinking that might give us some additional information.

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by oldguy » Dec 02 2010 7:55 am

I met Joe Domin for the first and only time on 23 November,2009. I was taking a break next to trail on my way out after clearing
and saw him walking back, too. I recognized him from his picture on Arizonahikers and he told me about Hike Arizona.
We walked back down together talking the whole time. I remember asking him if he let someone know about his
hiking plans (as I ask everyone) but I don't remember his answer. He did say he had a cell phone. He told me he was
trying to get out to Sheep Mountain but I don't think he said anything about his all night bailout the previous week. That
I would have remembered. I had just read on Arizonahikers that he was a new grandfather and I asked him about that.
I could tell he was pleased being Grandpa. I was impressed by his determination and willingness to get out and do the
hikes, even if he had to go alone. I've been following this search closely and trying to put the pieces together. It's sure a mystery.

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Re: Missing hiker in Mazatzals - gpsjoe (Joe Domin)

Post by oldguy » Dec 02 2010 8:15 am

An idea I had to search for Joe is to get high resolution pictures of the whole area. This should not be with a point-and-shoot camera but
rather a good quality SLR with a big sensor. It may take several flights to get optimal light for various areas; I think you would want
minimal shadows. The pictures would be big files so probably would have to be shared on DVDs but they could be shared with dozens
of people and all could zoom in and at least search the areas not covered by brush or trees. This could be a much more thorough search
than that done from an aircraft, even a slow moving helicopter. Perhaps this has already been done with no success.

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