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flume closing for good (big changes) this year!!
Posted: Dec 02 2003 4:29 am
by pfredricks
Apparently I must have had my head buried in the sand.
I didnt realize that childs/irving power plants were getting shut down and the fossil springs were going to be restored to their natural creekbed.
I havent heard anyone here mention specifics, but the forest service has a few DRAMATIC changes in mind for the area.
Read info about it here. What do you think?
THey may ban camping and fires in the area.
Dramatic changes due by December of 2004.
I havent done the trip from this side, but was reading about this place and wanted to pass this info along.
http://www.aps.com/my_community/StoryAr ... ve_18.html
and
http://www.epa.gov/fedrgstr/EPA-IMPACT/ ... i15092.htm
and
http://www.rmrs.nau.edu/lab/4302/fc/
Posted: Dec 07 2003 10:03 pm
by ajcanable
matt gilbert wrote:I think its time to get this topic back on track. I think this could be an informative and valuable discussion. Lets here what everyones opinions are about the issue at hand.
Well I guess i'll have to get off my behind and go check it out before it's gone so i'll be able to have an better informed opinion. I've never been up there but it really does sound like an interesting area!
Posted: Dec 08 2003 2:25 pm
by woopitup
Hey Pete - didn't you inspect the APS grounds personally last week? Near VHS, after night fall? [I'm hearing a distant bango belling out the tune from Deliverance??] : queen :
woopitup
Posted: Dec 08 2003 5:53 pm
by Abe
Hey guys and gals
, I have known of this for quite awhile. I remember Prescott's former Mayor suggesting The City of Prescott should purchase it. Talk about a laugh around the area.
Frankly, it does not bother me APS is shutting it down and changes are in the wind. If I recall, the Childs/Irvine Plant was not even generating a drop of power in the big bucket of power, as it were, to justify operating it. Besides, I am sure APS benefitted from this somehow; tax write-off, land swap, tax break, wheeling and dealing. And the enviornmentalist won one for the gipper.
The only thing that I can see which would upset folks is the tightening up of the land use around the area. The proposal mentioned earlier by azhiker96 may shed some light:
http://www.fs.fed.us/r3/coconino/nepa/2 ... osal.shtml
:idea: A thought, lets have a haz'er get together next year before it is closes in full.
Posted: Dec 09 2003 4:39 pm
by pfredricks
After carefully reviewing the above link, the proposal seems to include a provision to maintain the road to the VHS at its current level, so the ability to continue to enjoy the VHS seems preserved, at least for the moment.
THe following link shows that the proposal was approved and endorsed by some rather well known, and well regarded environmental groups.
http://phoenix.bizjournals.com/phoenix/ ... ily31.html
Here is a great website about the history of the power plants
Be sure to check out the slidshow
http://www.pinestrawhs.org/childsirving.htm
If you have been to the drop off of water after the childs plant (into the Verde) There is a neat riparian environment with travertine deposits that clearly was not there in the historical photos. I imagine that much of that would develop along fossil creek. That area looks just like the fossil springs area.
ANd so what if APS got a little publicity.
-Pete
Links
Posted: Dec 09 2003 4:56 pm
by sherileeaz
Posted: Dec 09 2003 8:46 pm
by olesma
Man - don't pay attention to the site for a few days and look what I miss.
Absolutely unreal thread. I was going to beat a dead horse - but there is clearly no point in it.
I'm just stunned really - speechless and not willing to really jump into the fray.
Incredible.
Re: Links
Posted: Dec 09 2003 8:50 pm
by sherileeaz
OOPS, GMTA, I posted this around the same time as Pfredricks and then also didn't realize Abe had a few of the same! SOWWY!!
I'm not quick enough! In more ways then one!! HAHA!
Sherileeaz
Posted: Dec 10 2003 12:37 am
by mttgilbert
http://verde.nau.edu/Research/CanyonEng ... eering.pdf
According to this link it sounds as if they are already planning on building a bridge across the current popular water crossing that would accomodate the new water flow. That must mean that they are planning on maintaining that road. moreover they just did (or are still doing) a bunch of construction on the road into childs from strawberry. If those are any indications it sounds like access to this area might still be possible.
Posted: Dec 10 2003 9:41 pm
by ADGibson
It just looks like the area will be restored to me. I can't see this as a bad thing. Are we sure that all of the deal has been disclosed to us? I need a conspiracy!
rural conspiracy theory.
Posted: Dec 14 2003 2:58 pm
by tinyelvis
Mzwell, "you people" sound like the same rural, retired, conspiracy-laden crazies that used to call my office everyday and complain about fat cat politicians selling them down the river. by the way, you are't the same people that send me 30 page manifestos telling me i don't have to LEGALLY pay taxes because you read it on the internet somewhere, are you? rural arizona is getting screwed left and right in regards to land exchanges and development rights (black river land exchange in Greer?)to hold your "knowledge" secretive, like some sort of asset or prize to be hoarded like a cereal box toy is not only arrogant, it's stupid. oh please, educate us narrow-minded, fast-paced way of life flatlanders..oh wait, deepthroat made you promise to keep quiet.
you baited people and it worked. congratulations. (why do you remind me of andy rooney?) now for contributing to the greater good, i still don't know why you feel this is such a bad idea.
by the way, boasting of an award from sue sitko and the rest of the nature conservancy is like announcing you have good breath for a dog... it still stinks!
regards,
RA
------------------
Confuscius say, "He who stands on toilet is high on pot."
living in my shorts
Posted: Dec 14 2003 6:47 pm
by te_wa
hilarious.
Posted: Dec 14 2003 7:11 pm
by sherileeaz
Okie Dokie....
Tis the season for good cheer.
Joy and laughter.
I don't think much more could be said that
hasn't been voiced other than keeping to the facts
of the original topic.
Not taking sides, just saying, it's a joyous time
of year, maybe we can get this back on track.
Happy Holidays!!! Peace.
Sherileeaz
Posted: Dec 14 2003 10:33 pm
by mttgilbert
I decided to lock this topic. I don't think that its going to get back on the intended topic. Hopefully the good effects of closing the power plant will outweigh the bad and we'll all be able to enjoy Fossil Creek for years to come.
Thank You and my apologies
(If it really makes you mad that I locked this topic, please feel free to PM me)
