HikeArizona.COM

Interesting article in Time Magazine.

One wonders how long it will take for land management agencies to adapt.

In my estimation, the first thing that will need to happen is that a significant number of cherished places will have to be largely damaged or destroyed. This may prompt enough public outcry (we can hope) where politicians will be forced to support the additional funding that agencies will need to manage the visitation. Use/entrance fees will likely be an intermediate step and will be introduced where they currently do not exist and increased where they do.

And for many places, it will be too late anyway. I just don't realistically see an alternative which provides a positive outcome.

Mora is far from the only one to witness worrying changes in national and state parks. Many of these spaces, supposed to be untouched swaths of time-proof wilderness, have been overrun by first-time visitors seeking refuge from quarantine, joblessness, or the inability to take far-flung vacations. And as people have flooded into the parks, new crises have arisen for rangers and nearby communities

rangers ... said they have all seen increases in visitation following COVID-19, particularly from first-timers. RV and camper sales have surged; so have campground reservations across the country. With travelers still leery of airplanes, and most indoor entertainment options closed, many families seem to be embracing a relatively cheap getaway option where the risk of catching the virus is much lower than it is indoors.

At Arizona lakes, visitors have left behind dirty diapers, shoes, broken glass and entire grills

https://time.com/5869788/national-parks-covid-19/

“We’ve been focusing on educating,” he says. “We’re trying hard not to take a punitive approach.”

Education only works on the unintentional ignorant. Others choose to remain ignorant because it's easier to have a good time and not care. Education will not help these current problems at all. People act in the outdoors like they act at home, except generally worse. They're like locusts and your worst alien fear. They consume and destroy one area and then simply move on to the next.

@outdoor_lover
Sadly, your thoughts/observations are accurate.

I noticed & commented to friends a couple of months ago how in the middle of the week, picnic tables & trails are now being used/hiked because children aren't in school & the unemployed are going picnicking instead of hunkering down inside the bunker. My perception is that if I went hiking on weekends I'd be highly at risk of exposing myself to COVID 19 because of crowds/throngs of people who aren't wearing masks & not social distancing.

330 million+ people in the United States, maybe more. Most people, judging by their body habitus and/ or the appearance of their home environment, are complete and total pigs, literally 1 step removed from wallowing in excrement. It should come as no surprise that when people who are completely uncouth enter that which the traditional outdoor crowd regards as their wilderness or protected areas, that the normal values will not be upheld. On one of my very, very first Humphrey Summit Hikes in September of 2006 I came upon a group of older women urinating directly on the trail! Not off to the side, or on a tree, or somewhere in view from the trail, but literally urinating on the surface that every other hiker would walk on. These were not, presumably, uninitiated newbies entering the wilderness for the first time, but were instead just an average representation of people, behaving in the manner they deemed acceptable. Therefore, should there be little wonder that when visitation increases, the incidence of that type of behavior increases, and actually gets worse? I think not.

@Jim_H
Thank you for sharing your thoughts/observations. I couldn't bring myself to like 'em.

I follow Hike Arizona for the good news and inspiration and yes there has to be an "Unlike Button" somewhere on HAZ.

fossil creek is a good example of a beautiful area getting trashed
haven't been there since the parking permit system, but before was pretty bad

@SuperstitionGuy
There already is an unlike button which appears after you like something.
Perhaps there could be an I understand your view & agree, however I wish it wasn't so, button.

I normally don't see anyone where I go. And that is still true, so far.

The last couple of months we've seen really high numbers of people in what I would call "living" in the forests. More than the height of hunting season. I mentioned it to our son who moved back from Seattle and is living and working in Cottonwood. He's been off roading, mtn. biking and hiking a lot up there now and between Cottonwood and Sedona he said the same thing is happening. He also noticed sites where people buy a cheap tent and some what he calls 70's webbed lawn chairs and set up to create a "camp" to be reserved for the weekend. Where he lived in Seattle he had Pikeys ( we're Irish so we can call them that) living in motor homes, now it's like that all over the Verde Valley, but with less Pikeys.

It would certainly be fitting punishment to see people forced to live and experience the overwhelming filth and destruction they cause. Imagine if in Fossil creek they never hauled out the trash, coolers, and diapers, and let it just accumulate into a gigantic health hazard and rotting garbage dump, with the creek a cesspool full of floating abandoned coolers and human waste. I wonder if people would still visit? Probably...

Like outdoor lover said, you shouldn't seem to need to educate people on basic practices like not littering and not drawing graffiti over every surface one will encounter. Willful ignorance is required to get that type of behavior. But until they make a law that you can take away a citizen's reproductive rights/body organs from people who demonstrate they are incapable of responsibly living and interacting in a civilized society and educating their kids with the same basic morals, we will forever have to continue to deal with this segment of society. The bad apples spoil it for everyone.

nonot wrote:The bad apples spoil it for everyone.

We compost our bad apples.

Alston_Neal wrote: ↑Jul 27 2020 12:57 pm The last couple of months we've seen really high numbers of people in what I would call "living" in the forests.

I think that there are a lot of homeless people essentially living in public lands or parking at TH's. If you drive on FR 525 between Sedona and Cottonwood, it looks like something out of "Grapes of Wrath". I have gotten at various TH's early in the morning and have woken up people (non-hikers) who were sleeping in cars.

All true.

Much less impact in the core Fossil Creek area than in years past. Managing can work if supported, funded and enforced. Yes, a rare trio that rarely adapts to changes.
Address the issue, zero tolerance for excuses, enforce consequences, provide necessary tools, be a role model, praise success*, repeat.
* no need to go overboard... lol

Bu but you can't manage every trail and definitely NOT where I hike! 7.8 billion people in the world, trending up.
Yeah I know, politics, yadda yadda yadda, unpopular**.
** That's me! Proof -> Cleghorn moved without ever inviting me on a hike so I know I'm not in the IN crowd =(

Jim_H wrote: ↑Jul 26 2020 12:51 pm On one of my very, very first Humphrey Summit Hikes in September of 2006 I came upon a group of older women urinating directly on the trail! Not off to the side, or on a tree, or somewhere in view from the trail, but literally urinating on the surface that every other hiker would walk on.

This past spring I was hiking on the Lost Dog Wash TH up to Sunrise Peak and some old grey haired woman was squatting down and urinating right in the middle of the trail...I couldn't believe it

I think that a bunch of newbies have all of a sudden decided to hit the trails, and imho social media has made it much, much worse. If you want some comic relief, go peruse some of the posts on facebook Arizona hiking groups. The ignorance and utter stupidity of some people is truly amazing!

@DixieFlyer
I have to wonder how these people's living rooms, or bathrooms appear. It isn't that hard to go 3 feet off the trail!

@Jim_H
yeah, there are brittle bushes and creosote bushes everywhere right off the trail...I would hate to walk inside some of these people's houses

Jim_H wrote: ↑Jul 27 2020 7:03 pm It isn't that hard to go 3 feet off the trail!

But snakes....why'd it have to be snakes?