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Ive been reading articles on how much Arizona is expected to grow within the next ten years. Along with the talk of the phoenix urban area and tucson urban areas meeting then Payson reaching phoenix. What Arizona conservation group is the most effective to stop this kind of growth and save Arizona's open. Because i want to get active in some of this conservation because if we don't try to do something Arizona's rural and open lands which i would say make Arizona, Arizona could virtually disappear.
Thanks

That's a tough one. Most of the groups that started taking the issue further (Further than, say, the Nature Conservancy has, for example) quickly found out what it was like to be up against a committed group of unscrupulous individuals with a virtually unlimited war chest and boundless political inroads at their disposal. It's patently impossible to make people who look upon the same places we look upon with awe while drawing parcel lines and totaling profits in their heads understand why what they are doing is wrong; never mind trying to have a civilized discussion about water...

It seems like the most effective groups focus on a single issue or geographic region, rather than the issue as a whole. Groups like Sky Island Alliance and the Coalition for Sonoran Desert Protection are doing some great work down this way. Someone else will have to chime in about where to go to get involved in Phoenix, however, since I'm unfamiliar with most of the groups up that way...

The Monkey Wrench Gang! Hands down.

rally_toad wrote:The Monkey Wrench Gang! Hands down.

Indeed!

Sometimes it really seems like that is the only approach that actually has an effect, unfortunately...

wrangler0 wrote:... Payson reaching phoenix....

Luckily, that isn't going to happen because of land ownership. Between Fountain Hills and Payson, you've got primarily National Forest land which can't be developed, along with two reservations. There's some tiny pockets of private land in between (Sunflower, Punkin Center) but nothing that will get in the way here.

Now, if you meant to say Prescott, there you've got a real issue. Phoenix will soon connect with Anthem, New River and Black Canyon City ... on to Cordes Junction, and right up 69 into Mayer, Dewey, Prescott Valley. This stretch is already so much in the process of being developed, there's probably very little that can be done to stop it.

Do you live in a house with a yard? Then you're the problem (ya, me too!). Until people prefer to live in 30-story condo/apartment towers in downtown Phoenix, homes with yards will continue to be built in any available open space. Simple supply-and-demand.

Ya sorry i meant to say Prescott.

Do you think phoenix is juct going to continue to grow for many years to come?

I believe Arizona has more land devoted to Forest, Wilderness, BLM, Preserves and such percentage wise than any other state. At least it's near the top of the ranks with such regards.

It depends on your politics and perspectives -
The Sierra Club is active & (usually) effective in Arizona.
The Arizona Cattlemen's Association has strong interests in stopping urban sprawl.

Find a group you can commit to and give it your time and money.

I'm not sure where Hayduke is these days. If you find him, tell him I said hello and wish him the best.

joe bartels wrote:I believe Arizona has more land devoted to Forest, Wilderness, BLM, Preserves and such percentage wise than any other state. At least it's near the top of the ranks with such regards.

I think in the continuous 50 we're only third to Texas and New Mexico...

Jeff MacE wrote:

joe bartels wrote:I believe Arizona has more land devoted to Forest, Wilderness, BLM, Preserves and such percentage wise than any other state. At least it's near the top of the ranks with such regards.

I think in the continuous 50 we're only third to Texas and New Mexico...

Ya that is true. I guess i was thinking more of around the phoenix area. Which i guess there is little that can be done to stop the growth. As long as the state keeps selling the trust lands there will continue to be growth. I just don't like the though of hiking in the superstition and looking out and seeing houses. Which is whats probley going to happen when the superstition vista are gets developed which it probley will.

I think you meant the "Lower 48." And yes, Alaska is mostly non-private land. I have always heard that Texas is mostly private land, though!! But Nevada is high on that public land list, maybe at the top? (I don't have time to do a search.) I am glad I live in AZ. I just returned from San Diego North County. Went hiking a little on Camp Pendleton Marine Base, camped on the beach there, also. It is wildflower season there, and very green. Camp Pendleton is So. Cal. without all the development. Very sad what has happened over there--I grew up there and it makes me sick every time I go for a visit.

Indian reservation land gives no guarantee of preservation. There are 19 Indian Reservations in San Diego County, (more than most states, and more than any other county in the US) which means there are at least 19 casinos, many of them in formerly remote areas. These draw many people to the backcountry on weekends, (although they obviously don't clog up the hiking trails--too busy playing the slots!), but the traffic is said to be pretty bad if you want to go hiking. Around these casinos are big RV parks and hotels--they are huge conglomerations of the ugliest sort of development, and most are way out in the boondocks.

I belong to the White Mtn. Conservation League. The current issue of concern here has to do with the FS Travel Mgmt. Plan and ATVs.

It seems you have to keep butting your head, one issue at a time. I'm thankful for all that AZ public land, though.

azbackpackr wrote:I think you meant the "Lower 48." And yes, Alaska is mostly non-private land. I have always heard that Texas is mostly private land, though!! But Nevada is high on that public land list, maybe at the top? (I don't have time to do a search.) I am glad I live in AZ. I just returned from San Diego North County. Went hiking a little on Camp Pendleton Marine Base, camped on the beach there, also. It is wildflower season there, and very green. Camp Pendleton is So. Cal. without all the development. Very sad what has happened over there--I grew up there and it makes me sick every time I go for a visit.

Indian reservation land gives no guarantee of preservation. There are 19 Indian Reservations in San Diego County, (more than most states, and more than any other county in the US) which means there are at least 19 casinos, many of them in formerly remote areas. These draw many people to the backcountry on weekends, (although they obviously don't clog up the hiking trails--too busy playing the slots!), but the traffic is said to be pretty bad if you want to go hiking. Around these casinos are big RV parks and hotels--they are huge conglomerations of the ugliest sort of development, and most are way out in the boondocks.

I belong to the White Mtn. Conservation League. The current issue of concern here has to do with the FS Travel Mgmt. Plan and ATVs.

It seems you have to keep butting your head, one issue at a time. I'm thankful for all that AZ public land, though.

Right, that should have said "Continuous 48." I have no idea what's going on near the supes, but *every* trail in the front range of the Catalinas is surrounded by huge, nasty villas. They just built a gaudy monstrosity in Pima across the trail blocking a large section of the view up-canyon as you first hike in. They're building more near Finger, and houses get closer and closer to lower Bear Canyon near Sabino every day. When are people going to figure out that there are some places that exist for all of us and our future generations to enjoy, not so they can own it and build fences?!

Is there any groups that have the mission of keeping state trust lands to the state for like conservation on stuff? Cause i dont mind paying for a permit if it means the land is protected from development. And does anyone know if the sale of the superstition vistas state trust land went through could not find anything?

Just an update about the superstitions. I talked to a lady from the sierra club and she told me that they try to prevent development but the land department whent through and sold the land and it will be devloped sadly.

Yea, that's where the Nature Conservancy seems to have the right idea. Rather than wasting time in the courts trying to block things legally like the Sierra Club, they typically work to purchase the land itself or other sections of property that would confound the development plan.

This issue really took center stage for me years back when I came to realize that growth is coming with another set of baggage in the form of overuse and misuse of already protected areas. Anyone been to Windy Point lately? If so - you already know what I'm talking about. The amount of graffiti, broken glass, beer cans, and other garbage is alarming...it's ALARMING. Three or four weeks ago I found a bunch of burned out Roman Candle tubes behind a rock up there. For that matter, all of Catalina Highway is strewn with litter. It's disgraceful. Part of me wishes nature turns the highway back into an unimproved Jeep trail forcing real dedication out of those who wish to enter.

One thing you can absolutely do to help is something I've done for years: Every time you go hike, take a plastic bag and pick up all of the litter you find on the trail. For the last couple years I never leave a trail without at least a few pieces of refuse, and usually leave with a full bag on more accessible trails...

wrangler0 wrote:Just an update about the superstitions. I talked to a lady from the sierra club and she told me that they try to prevent development but the land department whent through and sold the land and it will be devloped sadly.

Developer buys 1,010 acres of trust land

Carl Holcombe and Lars Jacoby
The Arizona Republic
Dec. 8, 2006 12:00 AM

The auction Thursday of 1,010 acres in Pinal County destroyed the notion that developers' appetite for state trust land had waned in a cooling real estate market and kicked off the future of the southeast Valley.

The auctioned land is in the Lost Dutchman Heights area, part of a 275-square-mile swath of state land between Apache Junction and Florence called Superstition Vistas.

At build-out, Superstition Vistas is expected to be home to a million people and will nearly double the size of the southeast Valley.

Desert Communities Inc., an affiliate of Las Vegas-based Rhodes Homes, beat out Denver-based Actus Lend Lease LLC with a final bid of $58.6 million.

"That's a great price for that view of the Supes (Superstition Mountains)," said Apache Junction Councilman Kris Sippel.

Roc Arnett, president and CEO of the East Valley Partnership, said Lost Dutchman's proximity to mountains for recreation, freeways and the future jobs center of Williams Gateway Airport made the site attractive to developers.

"What this says is that there is phenomenal value in the East Valley," Arnett said.

The seesaw 30-minute bidding battle also defused worries that another state land auction would flop. At the August auction of 325 acres at Desert Ridge in Phoenix, no one met the minimum price of $150 million.

As a result, the Arizona State Land Department delayed the Pinal County auction for months to redo land appraisals to better reflect the Valley's cooling real estate market.

Thursday's minimum price was $45.25 million.

The State Land Department predicted rooftops could start popping up about three years from now (2009/2010).

"It's the gateway to the future out here in this area," said Jim Rhodes, president and CEO of Rhodes Homes. The win also locks Desert Communities into master planning the entire 7,000-acre Lost Dutchman area, all of which is within Apache Junction city limits.

"(This) certainly was one of the highlights of the year and a good way too close out the year," said Land Commissioner Mark Winkleman.

City and state officials see the master-planning requirement as a way to encourage smarter planning and reduce the impact of rapid growth and sprawl.

However, the failure of both state land-reform propositions in the November election makes it tougher to coordinate planning cooperation among the state, affected municipalities and the developer, Winkleman said.

The development of this land offers new potential for Apache Junction, which is otherwise landlocked by Mesa, a national forest and wilderness, and mountains. Sippel said he relishes the city's chance to undergo some "quality growth" similar to Desert Ridge or Buckeye's Verrado.

This is not Rhodes Homes' first foray into Arizona. The company is developing Pravada, a 5,750-acre community near Kingman.

"We're excited. We're thrilled," said Apache Junction City Manager George Hoffman. "There has been a lot of work with the State Land Department to get to this point."

The city has hired a new planner with large-scale development experience to work with the state and Desert Communities, Hoffman said.

Master planning will include plotting locations for roads, infrastructure, job centers and utilities in an attempt to avoid problems that have plagued other fast-growing Valley areas.

"Like not building a house where we anticipate locating major transportation corridors," Hoffman said.

Desert Communities will pay 10 percent down and finance the rest of the deal with the state over seven years, State Land Department officials said.

Future auctions will determine who develops the rest of Lost Dutchman and Superstition Vistas.

If thats all that has been sold for now because 1100 acres isnt much in the grand scheme of things its like 1.5 square miles

Here is some new news on the Superstition Vista if any ones interested.




Report outlines needs for SE Valley, Pinal growth

Lynh Bui and Kerry Fehr-Snyder
The Arizona Republic
May. 1, 2008 12:00 AM
The Southeast Valley and Pinal County are on the verge of becoming either a giant cul-de-sac or part of a thriving megalopolis incorporating Phoenix and Tucson, a consultant's study will show Thursday.

The East Valley Partnership-sponsored report says the region needs to build four new freeways, push for a new stand-alone college or university and encourage more hospitals if it is to enter a mature and sustainable adulthood after years of explosive, sprawling growth.

The report, conducted by nationally renowned planner John Fregonese, will be unveiled at an East Valley Partnership business and government luncheon at the Arizona Grand Resort. Of the roughly 7.5 million people expected to pour into metro Phoenix by 2060, one-third of those residents are likely to call Pinal County and the southeast Valley home.
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One million of those could live on the 275 square miles of Superstition Vistas, a swath of state land sandwiched between Queen Creek, Florence, Apache Junction and the Superstition Mountains.

The Vistas is an area larger than Gilbert, Mesa, Tempe and Chandler combined.

The expanse of undeveloped desert is a prime chance to stray from Arizona's typical model of bedroom-community sprawl, proponents say. Roads, employment centers, trails and other infrastructure all could be laid out by a Superstition Vistas committee, which would include state, Pinal County and East Valley Partnership representatives.

Once that planning is done, the land would be sold to developers.

It also would be divided into political subdivisions. Although there is no guarantee that those entities will follow the plans laid out for the area, Vistas backers say such advance work can prevent cities playing catch-up with growth, as has been the case throughout the Valley.

"We want to understand how we do good planning so we reserve the right-of-way for roads and know where to put amenities and hook up trails so you don't have to go back over and destroy and rebuild," said Pinal County Supervisor Sandie Smith. "We're looking for something that's not more of the same."

And more of the same right now is pretty grim. About half of the county's workers drive to the western edge of Pinal County or to neighboring Pima or Maricopa counties to work. There are about 260 jobs for every 1,000 residents in Pinal, compared with 585 in Maricopa County.

Commutes along Hunt Highway, the major road out of Pinal County, surpass the one-hour mark during rush hour.

"When you take a look at the catalysts in the East Valley, the potential is exciting but the work that needs to be done is staggering," said Roc Arnett, East Valley Partnership president and chief executive officer.

Arnett said the study's findings are part of the business and political group's ongoing discussion about the region's future, promise and potential peril.

"It's up to the body politic," Arnett said. "Do we leave things as the status quo or do we move ahead?"

Arnett warned that traffic patterns are one of the area's biggest challenges.

"If we just put traffic in and out, it (the region) just becomes a cul-de-sac," he said.

But of the four freeways planned between now and then to alleviate traffic bottlenecks, none is yet funded by the Maricopa Association of Governments, the region's planning group.

Arizona Department of Transportation Director Victor Mendez recently said his agency will run out of money to build freeways by 2015 and that only money to maintain existing roads will be available.

Handling road construction and other issues will determine whether the southeast Valley and Pinal County become a model for smart growth or one of the country's fastest-growing region chokes to death from poor planning.

With rising gas prices and heightened talk of global warming, the pressure is on to build more self-contained communities rather than relying on commutes to Phoenix and Tucson for employment, entertainment and education.

Fregonese, the planner, determined that northern Pinal County and the southeast Valley could grow into an environmentally friendly region with strong employment centers, diverse housing, quality schools and recreation access.

7.5 million people expected to pour into metro Phoenix by 2060

7.5 MILLION PEOPLE are expected to move to the Valley?!?!?!? Where will the water come from for all those people? I am so sick of mega growth! Arizona does NOT need any "Superstition Vistas" or "Anthems"! I'm shutting up now, and restraining my four letter words.