HikeArizona.COM

Any person who spends a significant amount of time outdoors in Arizona will eventually be confronted with a rattlesnake. The probabilities of encounter depend on four variables: the number of miles hiked, the location, the season, and the time of day. Much like a Las Vegas casino, where the House always wins, finding a rattlesnake is a positive expectancy.

The question is: Will you kill the rattlesnake, and what are the consequences, if any, of such action?

First, let’s explore the legality of snake killing. Under Commission Order 43, a valid Arizona hunting license is required to possess or kill a rattlesnake in areas open to hunting. No more than 4 rattlesnakes per year can be killed or possessed. Of the 13 species of rattlesnake present within Arizona, three are protected and cannot be killed or possessed: the rock rattlesnake, the twin-nosed rattlesnake, and the ridge-nosed rattle snake.

So it is now established that rattlesnakes can be harvested if done in a lawful manner. Why then, do we feel compelled to kill every rattlesnake that we come across? The motivations are many, but these are the two most common:

A. Fear
B. A man must protect his family

There is no doubt, rattlesnakes are very dangerous. Their venom can cause massive nerve and tissue damage, and in rare cases, even death (1% mortality rate). For this reason, this animal deserves a great deal of respect and should be dealt with caution. However, it is not necessary to destroy all things that might do us harm, to kill what we fear. Is this fear justified in relation to other, much more likely, dangers to our person? A good example is the television program, 1000 Ways To Die, which shows a cornucopia of interesting and gruesome ways ordinary Americans have met their end. The dangers in this world are many, but it is pure folly to live your life in a state of constant fear. We fear snakes, so we destroy them. We fear terrorism, so we allow our wives and children to be molested at the airport. etc. etc. etc.

It is a man’s duty to protect his family from harm. Under no circumstances would he allow venomous reptiles to come in contact with those under his care. Therefore, any and all rattlesnakes found near his home should be removed. This is just common sense and the right thing to do.

However, this line of reasoning can be taken to extremes: If the snakes that live near his hearth and home must be destroyed, then should not the ones further away be killed, as well? For they too, pose a threat to the lives of his family, however remote. The motives behind this rationale are sound, but the likelihood of his family ever coming in contact with a rattlesnake deep in the backwoods is essentially zero, so why then must the animal be killed? It poses no threat to anyone but him, the man who hiked deep in-country, not because it was easy, but because it was hard.

Rattlesnakes have been very good to me in the field, so in gratitude, I have become an advocate of sorts, and refrain from killing them. I have sat on, kicked, brushed aside, and crawled next to, over a dozen rattlesnakes during my travels. Never once did they bite me. Was it mere luck, or something else? Perhaps there is guardian angel looking out for me? This is unlikely. Being a ‘C and E’ Christian, (they only attend Christmas and Easter church services) I am not eligible for divine intervention, so I am told. On the contrary, my luck with snakes has to do with Snake Karma.

Snake Karma: Those who live and let live, who choose life over death, create a peaceful coexistence with the snake. The snake poses no threat to those who are no threat to him. It gives pardon when it has the upper hand, as do you, when the advantage is yours. Goodness begets goodness, just as evil begets evil.

Kill one snake too many, and your fate just might be sealed,
for a rattlesnake awaits you, in some faraway, forgotten field.
You have a rendezvous with death, you that unlucky one percent,
The Reaper has your name now; it is far too late to repent.
He will arrive in the form of a snake, whose bite will be your end,
For those who choose a different path, the snake is a lifelong friend.

I don't kill anything unless it is actively in the process of trying to kill me (and has the actual ability to do so).
(Insects excluded, and rodents in rare circumstances).

Even if I had been struck by a rattlesnake, I couldn't see myself killing it. The antivenin available in AZ doesn't require identification of the species of rattlesnake, so there's no reason to kill it. After all, chances are 99.9% that I was invading his home, not the other way around. And even in the case of a rattlesnake coming into my home in the "city", there's no reason to kill it to relocate it.

Personally I have no desire to kill snakes or anything so maybe I'm not seeing it straight.

Something like 85% of all bites are initiated by people messing with 'em.
They really have no desire to waste their venom on something they know they can't consume either.

I've never heard of someone being chased by a rattlesnake so why would we respond violently to their mere presence?

Interesting read.
Growing up in Louisiana my grandfather taught me (nay, engrained in me) that "your trigger is your safety" and "if it moves, shoot it." Friends and I would actually go walk the swamps, each with gun in hand, trying not to blow each other's feet off while "cottonmouth (Water Moccasin) hunting." You didn't have to walk far.
It was weird moving out here and not drawing on every desert critter I saw. I remember early on not having my gun and almost stepping into a striking rattler next to a mine and I couldn't figure out why my AZ friend wouldn't give up his gun. "But it's a snake!" I said. That was all I knew and I just couldn't wrap my mind around letting it be so after some harsh words, I borrowed a couple of bullets and dispatched the snake anyway.
I don't anymore.

joe bartels wrote:Something like 85% of all bites are initiated by people messing with 'em.
They really have no desire to waste their venom on something they know they can't consume either.

And something like 90% of those bites are on the hands of males between 18 and 34 with alcohol in their system. Some ER Docs were joking that buzzworms have an affinity for alcohol. So maybe they aren't trying to envenomate, they're trying to get some booze.

I was taught not to kill what I wasn't going to eat. So I guess my snake karma would depend on how tired I was of dehydrated backpacking meals.

What doesn't kill me
better make me stronger
or run away real fast.

I wouldn't kill a snake unless it was a split-second reflex response with no conscious volition behind it. I figure that's unlikely based on my experience so far. My initial reaction usually gets me beyond harm and I don't feel threatened outside striking distance. I'd prefer to see the snake doing its natural thing and get a picture if I can. I've been scared when a snake went somewhere ahead of me that I couldn't see, but I just skirted way around.

What's the actual likelihood of getting bitten by a rattlesnake? Very low if you keep your distance I'm sure. I don't recall anyone on this website being bitten in the last few years since I have been frequenting this site. Hundreds of thousands of miles hiked, no bites that I know of. Makes me wonder what the real risk is. People, in general, overreact to rattlesnakes. My 2 cents.

Hmmm. I haven't heard of a human being bitten but I think I remember someones dog bitten by one. I have seen Wally dance with one.I have been known to scream "like a girl" a few times when I've seen one.

I'm in agreement with:

chumley wrote:I don't kill anything unless it is actively in the process of trying to kill me (and has the actual ability to do so).

Tough_Boots wrote:I've never heard of someone being chased by a rattlesnake so why would we respond violently to their mere presence?

joe bartels wrote:Something like 85% of all bites are initiated by people messing with 'em.
They really have no desire to waste their venom on something they know they can't consume either.

@chumley I too will not kill anything needlessly
@Tough_Boots While rattlesnakes will strike at people, they will not pursue them.
@teva joe Yes, and inebriated 18-24 year old males make up the bulk of that, many bitten in the upper arms and face. One popular thing is kissing the rattler and I'll be doggone if it doesn't oblige. Unfortunately not enough of these folks meet their demise so our gene pool isn't cleansed of them.

So correct about not wasting venom. They hunt by heat signature and the human signature is generally enough they know they cannot hope to digest it so they try to avoid, try to scare off with the rattle, or if necessary bite them but not release evenom.

The most likely rattlers to inject venom no matter what they are biting is a very young one because they haven't yet learned the art of conserving venom for their prey. The old grizzled veteran rattlers almost never inject venom unless they believe it to be prey. The key word is believe.
Take the scenario of someone slowly climbing up a steep rocky area:
1. They aren't causing as much vibration as walking which would give prior warning to the snake to leave or draw back.
2. By reaching a hand up to grasp another handhold, if there were a rattler there all it sees is the small heat signature of the hand, assumes it is prey and strikes, releasing it's venom because again, it believes it to be it's prey. For the unfortunate person to be on the receiving end it's time to get to a medical facility. :stretch:

That is the only scenario where I consciously raise my vigilance when hiking. Other than that, I simply don't worry about them. Since I moved to AZ in 2002 I've ridden a bike right over one curled between two rocks on the trail, I've ridden my bike within 2" of the head of one sunning itself (moving fast enough I barely had time to miss it), on at least a half-dozen occasions I've stepped over and/or within inches of coiled rattlers (http://hikearizona.com/photo.php?ZIP=173034 is the most graphically documented) and I've been rattled at by a few that were within 12-18" of me and elbow height right next to the trail (switchbacks on Mt Peeley was the closest) yet I've never once been in fear of being struck at, let alone being bitten.

Having grown up in South Africa I had so many snake encounters of the poisonous kind (losing my dog to a black mamba right in front of me) as well as non-poisonous like pythons that I gained a great fascination for snakes, educated myself about them and ultimately gave great respect to them. As you can see my curiosity of snakes continues to this day. I have many rattler videos still to edit and post on YouTube but here a choice encounter as well as a page of stills:
http://www.changephoenix.com/10/videos1 ... attler.swf
http://www.changephoenix.com/10w/10rattlesnakes.html

Only the rattler in the second row of photos struck at me, but there were extenuating circumstances...
I took his meal away from him by accident. I was biking on the Moon Rock trail at Usery Park and saw a ground squirrel chugging along down a wash and realized if he didn't turn off as the trail turned toward him I'd probably run him over so I slowed slightly to avoid him. But as I came around the corner, he saw me and made an immediate left turn just as a rattler struck from behind a bush at the squirrel, recoiling as I rode by. I jumped off the bike and came back to take photos of the rattler and he was mad! And rightly so. I took a few closeups of it while it continued to rattle and was just about to turn around to head back to my bike when it struck (hence the slight blur in the photo) but I simply side-stepped and walked away. If one were to call it that, I guess you could say I provoked it, but then it wasn't by design, it just happened.

johnlp wrote:What's the actual likelihood of getting bitten by a rattlesnake? Very low if you keep your distance I'm sure. I don't recall anyone on this website being bitten in the last few years since I have been frequenting this site. Hundreds of thousands of miles hiked, no bites that I know of. Makes me wonder what the real risk is. People, in general, overreact to rattlesnakes. My 2 cents.

Probably more likely to be struck by lightning in AZ than by a rattler, although the odds go up the more time spent in their habitat. Yes, I do agree most people overreact to rattlers, as well as any kind of snake whether harmful or not.

Fear of snakes keeps many people tied to the towns. Let 'em stay there. The trails are getting too crowded anyway.

I can't count the number of times, when living in Tucson, if I mentioned my passion for hiking, that the response from the other person would be: "Aren't you afraid of snakes?" There are countless thousands of people out there who live in fear of all kinds of things, constantly. These people can be seen (if you're a parent of young kids and are around a lot of other parents) frequently teaching fear to their kids as well. That always used to bother me a lot. People grow up feeding these various fears, and they become entrenched in the psyche. They are so fearful of so many things they don't even realize what they are fearful of.

Perhaps the fear of snakes is somehow symbolic of all these other fears. A way to roll their fears into one general place, since they aren't acknowledging fear of unemployment, fear of having unpleasing clothing or appearance, fear of poverty, fear of people who are different than they are, etc., etc.

That's my psycho-babble for the day.

Respect, but don't fear. ;)

One day I wasn't paying attention to the trail and suddenly heard a rattle. I looked down and my foot was directly over the snake and I was about 6 inches from stepping on it. It didn't strike and instead slithered away quickly as I did some acrobatics and jumped back. Neither one of us wanted anything to do with each other. Then a couple weeks ago when we saw an Arizona Black on the Wilderness of Rocks, it rattled to let us know it was there and when we didn't go away it would get comfortable and stop rattling. If we got too close it would start to rattle and then stop again. They're just not aggressive-- though I wouldn't want to surprise one. Keep your distance, don't be dumb, leave them be-- and they'll do the same.

Just saw this article from Outside Magazine. I guess you would call this guy Pincushion Bill

Venom is a subject Bill Haast knows like the back of his hands—hands that are gnarled and mangled from having been bitten 163 times by some of the world's deadliest snakes. At 86, Haast still works year-round at his Miami Serpentarium Laboratories, an indoor-outdoor facility in the chiggery flatlands of rural Florida near Punta Gorda. Home to more than 400 snakes, the 80-acre Serpentarium also boasts a one-of-a-kind serpent "propagation enclosure"—a grassy, palmetto-filled space designed expressly to get its languorous inhabitants in the mood.

http://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-ad ... te-Me.html

So what was the worst bite ever?

If you mean the closest I came to death, that would have been in 1956, when I was bitten by a Siamese cobra on national television. It was during a live broadcast of Marlin Perkins's Zoo Parade. The snake struck at my arm, my wife screamed, and the network cut to a commercial. I stopped breathing and was put in an iron lung. It was two days before I was breathing on my own.

What's bitten you most recently?
A western diamondback. I must have blinked at the wrong second. He got me on the back of the left hand.

Do you even flinch at such bites anymore?
Oh, I guess so. I was on the floor with spasms and convulsions this time. I spent the night in intensive care. And my hand was swollen for maybe two or three weeks, which always happens with a viper bite.

About those hands—they're something of a roadmap to your career, aren't they?
They have taken a beating. A bite from an eastern diamondback rattlesnake left one hand curled like a claw. The venom of a Malayan pit viper made my index finger kind of hooked. And two years ago, a cottonmouth bit the tip of my right pinkie. Cottonmouth venom dissolves tissue. So most of the finger turned black and lost feeling. All that was left was a blackened bit of bone sticking out. My wife, Nancy, took a pair of garden clippers and cut that off.

Would those be the same kind of clippers people use on, say, roses?
Similar to that. Yep.

The pink buzzworms in the Grand Canyon are so docile, you have to pick them up and slap them around a few times just to get them agitated enough to get a decent photo. That's one reason I don't have a good photo of them yet.

He singlehandedly ( ) makes up the 10% of people not 18-24.

Has anyone ever had a problem with rattle snakes getting too close while sleeping outside under the stars as opposed to sleeping in a tent? I try to leave a tent behind whenever I can. I sometimes wonder if I will wake up next to a rattler trying to warm itself.

skatchkins wrote: Growing up in Louisiana my grandfather taught me (nay, engrained in me) that "your trigger is your safety" and "if it moves, shoot it."

Yep, just about all of my hunting friends kill every snake that they come across, even non-poisonous ones. It is kind of a macho thing...Most of us started killing as a child, with our first BB gun, when we embarked on a campaign to eradicate each and every bird in the neighborhood.

One hand washes the other. I try not to wrong those who have done me right, and in this case, the snakes should have nailed me, but decided to cut me a break. I probably would have survived their bite, and likely become disfigured on account of being so far away from help. The venom melts the tissue away, leaving horrendous wounds.

Here on HAZ I'm just a Trendsettin" Kokopelli, but on another site they call me the "SnakeCharmer". This came about after I did one 13.5 mile hike in the Supes and saw snakes (FIVE of them) in one day and then saw snakes on every hike after that. Rattlesnakes, Bull snakes, green whip snakes, grass snakes......it didn't matter.....they were EVERYWHERE. I even went OUT OF STATE into Utah and, you guessed it, saw snakes. It's been a running joke for many years that if you want to see a snake on a hike......hike with me!

My first & second & third encounters with western diamondbacks were in the Supes (same hike) and I'm hearing impaired so I heard this rattling noise and was like "what the heck is that?" I can only picture it as a cartoon character where the light bulb goes off over their head when they realized what it was!

It freaked me out at first all those years ago but now I just find a way around them. I'd never kill them or harm them. I just want to get around them...after all I'm the one invading their territory. Hiking up the Escalante River last year there was this big snake by the side of the trail......my cousin flipped out but I was like...."let's just keep movin' on. No big deal."

So you can submit me as "NO KILL".

Chazz_Reinhold wrote:Has anyone ever had a problem with rattle snakes getting too close while sleeping outside under the stars as opposed to sleeping in a tent? I try to leave a tent behind whenever I can. I sometimes wonder if I will wake up next to a rattler trying to warm itself.

not picking on you specifically bro.. but you have to think outside.. a hammock is what exists outside the box.

azbackpackr wrote:Perhaps the fear of snakes is somehow symbolic of all these other fears.

hehe, there's this little gem of a book called genesis (author unknown) that reminds me of snakes. lol.

@Chazz_Reinhold if te-wa is picking on you I'd fight back... he's only 4 ft 8 ;)

@te-wa wasn't there some snake incident on your 2007 hike with Liz & Hoffmaster