HikeArizona.COM

I saw this on KPHO news last night: http://www.kpho.com/video?clipId=7426527&autostart=true A double crested saguaro in the Four Peaks area has been destroyed. I don't know much more, but it would be nice if someone local could confirm/deny. The man who reported the story called it King Crest.

Ugh...why? Samurai practice?? Unbelievable...

Crazy!

My friends, Bob Cardell and Pat Hammes of Tucson have recorded more than 1,000 of these crestate/cristate saguaros. More than anyone else. And they are still looking. Last I talked to them, they hadn't yet even had time to get out to Western Arizona.

Here is their photo website: http://www.crestedsaguarosociety.org/slideshow.html

I was walking past the one at the entrance to the Desert Museum this weekend and this popped into my mind and, once again, I thought: "Why??!"

I agree. Absolutely senseless. Crested saguaros fascinate me, I have located 5 or 6 I think, in the area hubby and I frequent. Plus there are two more I get to see every day on my commute to work. I'd hate to see something happen to them.

It's people who do these idiotic things that cause areas to be closed down.

I hope it's not some kind of new "Trophy" craze....

This frustrated the HE!! out of me today!!!! Wondered where it was on the way up and all I saw of it was 10 ft of the base! Some people need to be put down!!!! Makes me sick. Im no tree hugger but that is just wrong!

Too much rip rap in this state. Then toward the top somebody spray painted 3 sides of a boulder off the road! Man what I would do to people if I could catch them in the act!

RIP

http://hikearizona.com/photo.php?ZIP=223434

Very sad and disappointing.

There seems to be a voyeuristic and wantonly destructive aspect to some of the younger generation and other segments of our society that did not exist in such high proportions in decades past.

jeffmacewen wrote:There seems to be a voyeuristic and wantonly destructive aspect to some of the younger generation and other segments of our society that did not exist in such high proportions in decades past.

Well, I don't know about that, but we are noticing it these days. Us mature folk. I don't know why they want to destroy something that took so long to exist. Maybe it's the attitude of, "I have nothing so I'll take away from everyone else". Maybe they don't even think about it.

Being back in the Valley in the Chandler area, it strikes me how crowded it is, how crowded Arizona is, and how much development there is down here in this "sluggish economy". What recession? There is development everywhere, and sprawl to the max. At least south on 10 there is very little natural looking desert, or nothing like what exists around South Mountain or in the hills around Tucson. It's hard to make people think about natural beauty when bulldozers push it away to make pad sites.

I guess they don't live as long as some of the west's oldest trees, but they the older ones have seen a lot of change in Arizona. One has to wonder if some cactus that started growing at the beginning of white settlement, and has seen the large rise in population and development, will see the a decline in population and retraction in development. Lots of speculation there, but it would be interesting to see the change that a cactus germinate in 1870 might see if it lived 250 years or so. I assume that is an extreme upper end for a Saguaro.

Good point. I would not be surprised if the 's didn't post it on Facebook or YourTube. It's amazing how often criminals do that ...

Hey, my summit video of Sierra Blanca was only posted of FB, not Yourtube!!! ;)

jeffmacewen wrote:There seems to be a voyeuristic and wantonly destructive aspect to some of the younger generation and other segments of our society that did not exist in such high proportions in decades past.

I think that is just a youth thing. People get older and try to pretend that their generation didn't do stupid stuff, too. Now its just easier to document because people announce it all over the internet. Whenever I hear these statements I think of that part in the Breakfast Club when the principle is complaining about how the kids are getting worse and the janitor responds: "The kids haven't changed-- you have."

Growing up in Georgia, I used to hear adults talk about some pretty disgustingly violent things they used to do when they were kids-- things way worse than destroying a cactus. If anything, they've gotten less crazy since everyone is always so scared of their lives being broadcasted online. There is an arrogance to aging that is no less ignorant than the arrogance of youth.

I disagree. I'm only a decade or so removed from most of the "folly years" but I would NEVER have even contemplated destryoing a saguaro or any one of the dozens of other dumb things I see on a daily basis. The same could be said of most all of the people I knew or was familiar with back then, too. I get what you're saying, but my original point stands: "Something is different NOW." Maybe it's the fact that they are all trying to upstage one-another on the Internet, I don't know.

@jeffmacewen

jeffmacewen wrote:"Something is different NOW."

I agree. I think it has to do with a heightened sense of entitlement and lack of having to take responsibility....

There is a lack of responsibility, and it's not just kids. They just see it from the examples set by their "role models". From corrupt and hypocritical clergy, to corrupt and lying politicians, to corrupt and greedy businesspeople. No, not everybody...but enough, across enough sectors of society that the example is set and each generation will just get worse. There are few consequences for poor behavior anymore, and it's only human nature to push the envelope. We are probably all guilty of it in one aspect or another. I know I am.

But wait!!! It gets better:

http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valley ... r_gets.php

Our hero -- he of the eight weekends in jail wet noodle wrist slap -- is not a new felon. No. He is a *convicted* scam artist.

And still got off with a pink unicorns & rainbows "punishment" ...

I think its the wealth of information we all have open to us anymore that is the change. I dont think kids mischievous behavior has changed over time... just what the come up with to do so. And just because 'you' could not fathom chopping down a cactus in your youth, doesnt mean somebody else coulda. Example: Im not sure how old they were but in the early 80's when those 2 roommates that shot out at a saguaro only to have a limb fall and kill one of them.

And to say its the youth is just nieve. Look who started the mistake fire viewtopic.php?t=7149

Stupidy comes in all ages

The real change that has caused more and more of these problems is parents have lost their back-bone. nuff said

jeffmacewen wrote:There seems to be a voyeuristic and wantonly destructive aspect to some of the younger generation and other segments of our society that did not exist in such high proportions in decades past.

I love when old folks claim they were perfect. This argument is fallible. The population has grown exponentially since decades past, so the isolated "voyeuristic and wantonly destructive" things your generation did just happen with (more or less) the same isolated percentage, which leads to an exponentially higher number of incidents today. And since everybody can use technology to more easily share info today, an enormously larger amount of people find out about these destructive acts today than they did "in decades past".

nonot wrote:

jeffmacewen wrote:There seems to be a voyeuristic and wantonly destructive aspect to some of the younger generation and other segments of our society that did not exist in such high proportions in decades past.

I love when old folks claim they were perfect. This argument is fallible. The population has grown exponentially since decades past, so the isolated "voyeuristic and wantonly destructive" things your generation did just happen with (more or less) the same isolated percentage, which leads to an exponentially higher number of incidents today. And since everybody can use technology to more easily share info today, an enormously larger amount of people find out about these destructive acts today than they did "in decades past".

Please try not to oversimplify what I said, as I made no such claim. My friend, I suspect I am not that much your elder. That said, I still remember the guys with the SKS who shot up a saguaro and the one was killed. It was big news in Tucson back then (I was in grade school, but I still remember it.) Dumb things happened then and we found out about them almost instantly. There was no communications gap that I could perceive. I still remember the bozo who fell into the empty swimming-pool-in-construction at the Galleria on Oracle and had to be extricated and airlifted. We were in school when it happened sans any electronic device and heard about it that afternoon. Word spread fast, just as fast as it does today. Today it just spreads further in less time.

Population increase might play a minor role, but it cannot explain it all. I would counter that such an increase should also see a concomitant increase in ingenuity, science, art, and other aspects important to society and not just stupidity. Such has not been seen since the early 90's, and it was limited to technology. Instead, I would argue, we have a lot of people who feel less and less like their lives have any meaning or that they have anything to strive for. Couple that with the fact that nearly every opportunity for a young person to enter a trade or profession has been either shipped overseas or devaluated by the proliferation of cheapened "education" and we get what we have today. A group of people who are looking for a place to direct their energy and attention, who want to feel like anything they do will matter, and who are so desperate to stand out that they will take a sword to a cactus to get hits on YouTube (Presumably.)