HikeArizona.COM

guess it's safe now, but was surprised to run across this in Lyding's favorite range

Tonto National Forest wrote:1. In the mid-1960s the Forest Service treated chaparral vegetation with an herbicide mixture of 2,4,5-T and 2,4-D [also known as Agent Orange] on the Globe Ranger District, Tonto National Forest.
2. Spraying was isolated to Kellner, Icehouse, and Six-shooter canyons.
3. According to EPA, the residue from spraying is gone from the environment after one growing season as it is broken down by sun and weather.
4. In 1992 and 1993, the Arizona Department of Environmental Quality (ADEQ) sampled for 2,4,5-T, 2,4-D, silvex and their metabolites in Kellner Canyon and found no detectable amounts in all water and sediment samples. ADEQ Study 1992 (117KB)
5. In 1998, the Agency for Toxic Substances and Disease Registry (ATSDR) performed a Health Consultation for the dioxin spraying. They found there was no reason for further health or environmental follow-up. ATSDR/Cong. Hayworth ltrs pdf (300K) and ATSDR Study 1998 pdf (341KB)

I think they did the same thing around the same time over in the Three Bar Study Area over by Big Oak Flat between Roosevelt Lake and Four Peaks. Most of it is gone now, but when I first went up to Browns Peak that way in 1970, there was a big network of rain and stream gauges there and there was active research in rainfall, vegetation, and runoff.

ah
I always wondered what they were "studying" at Three Bar

Saw some Agent Red along Sixshooter Trail this past June.

@joe bartels That's not good! My father was covered in that stuff back in '65-'66. He was with MCB-3, a Sea Bee construction battalion based out of Port Hueneme near Ventura California. He was one of the first 50,000 combat troops ashore in Viet Nam. Being a Sea Bee, one of his duties was to unload pallets from the ships that were supplying the war effort. The Navy has never been known to take real good care of their materiel during sea transit and it was inevitable that many drums of Agent Orange developed leaks or were ruptured. It was also inevitable that my father would end the day covered in it. In 2006 my family was at a wedding in California and my dad left the festivities unannounced, and for several hours we all wondered where he was. He had driven himself home and said that he had the worst pain he had ever experienced. Well, he checked into the VA Medical Center Long Beach. It was discovered that he had prostate cancer. During his battery of tests the hospital found that he also had Atrial Fibrillation. He went through surgery for both ailments and was eventually granted 100% disability benefits in relation to his extreme exposure to Agent Orange. Until recently, he had been doing relatively fine but had developed a nasty cough. The VA here in Phoenix did some tests and found that he has throat cancer. He's currently healing from extensive radiation treatment. Still has a nasty cough but not as bad. So I guess what I'm saying is, this poison in the environment is definitely not something to be trifled with. I know the Govt. has stated that the stuff degrades well with time and weather but do you believe everything the Govt. says? Their recent track record seems to speak otherwise. Is there a map of the affected areas? I've never been hiking in the Pinals, but from the photos everybody posts, I would much like to visit these areas. I would just like to have the piece of mind knowing what areas are exposed to this nasty stuff. I'm sure that it's not solely in the Pinal Mountains.

Here is some more info on the Three Bar studies

http://www.rmrs.nau.edu/watersheds/high ... escription

RWStorm wrote:Here is some more info on the Three Bar studies

http://www.rmrs.nau.edu/watersheds/high ... escription

The conclusion is a little chilling: "If chaparral shrub suppression is desired, burning must be combined with other control methods such as applications of soil-applied herbicides or mechanical control methods."

Wonderful.

I can relate to beterarcher's dad. Gulf War I vet here. In Kuwait, after the war, we stationed about a mile from the largest well fire in the country. Depending on which way the wind was blowing any given day -- off the sea, good, towards the sea, bad -- the smoke was so thick in our compound that you literally could not see the front hood of your vehicle. One day an EPA guy shows up, sets out his monitors. A few hours later -- much, much sooner than scheduled, he quickly packed them up and disappeared never to be seen or heard from again. I had some occasional odd rashes on my joints for a few years afterwards, but nothing since. Makes you wonder. The military sure does not care about you during your service as long as you are well enough to shoot people and break stuff. Aftwards? *mmph* Whatever. They got what they wanted. I'm not surprised a lot of guys got cancer or had weird babies ... :SB:

That's crazy. Why would anyone want to drop herbicide all over a few acres of national forest? For one thing it would create a huge fire hazard. Perhaps I'll be able to hit the Pinals when I'm there in November.

Upon reading the thread title, I thought it was referring to a mountaintop punk concert....te-wa and I can only wish, I suppose.....

hippiepunkpirate wrote:Upon reading the thread title, I thought it was referring to a mountaintop punk concert....te-wa and I can only wish, I suppose.....

I thought Agent Orange broke up in the late 80's! Now if Suicidal Tendencies or Bad Religion were there........

A band calling itself "The Dead Kennedys" were just in town. I guess East Bay Ray appeared, but no Jello = no DKs.

@kingsnake
No Jello?! Those ain't the DK's!! :yuck:

I guess we deviated a bit from the original post but it was fun to reminisce.

Jello's band is called The Guantanamo School of Medicine
iirc, Agent Orange is still around, saw a flyer for them last month in San Diego
i just missed, to my resentment, a show at the Martini Ranch. who played? OFF!

anyway, this thread caught my eye as im leaving in the morning for a summit of Pinal via Icehouse. wanna see more bears!

beterarcher wrote:I guess we deviated a bit from the original post but it was fun to reminisce.

and I thought only my threads were hijacked.

The Crystal Method is my music drug of choice.