HikeArizona.COM

Hello! I'm the organizer for a small social/activities group in Phoenix, and we're considering an overnight backpacking trip up Kendrick in August. Some of us will be camping near the summit, but a few either don't have any gear, won't have a full set of gear by then, or will find the hike challenging enough even without gear. These folks may prefer to car camp.

I've read the Coconino dispersed camping guidelines, and it appears there may be no problem car camping or camping near the Kendrick trailhead unless it's otherwise posted. I'm in Phoenix and can't easily find out. How might I find out if it's acceptable?

Thanks!

call kaibab forestry service. 928.635.5600

best call as the squirrel suggests for confirmation, unless someone knows for sure

From what I just read and have experienced in the past: roads nearby Kendrick are open to dispersed camping. The Coconino site says it has "designated dispersed" sites in addition to "You may camp most anywhere on the Coconino National Forest (unless otherwise posted)"

Sedona is campgrounds only.

Prescott is campgrounds or "designated dispersed" only.

The Kendrick trailhead is just inside the Kaibab NF boundary. There are signs posted right at the trailhead indicating No Camping, but I think that only applies within a few hundred feet of the parking lot. I have seen numerous people camping a little bit further away. I'm assuming that is perfectly okay, but best to call Kaibab NF to confirm.

yeah Kaibab, duh
http://hikearizona.com/map.php?QX=5445

Here is a link to the travel management plan for the northern half of Coconino National Forest. You can camp on roads highlighted in yellow. This map cuts off at the start of the Kaibab National Forest near Kendrick.

You can download an App called Avenza & download this PDF for use in the field. It's very convenient when driving down forest roads

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOC ... avel%20Map

I have a few things to add starting with the Kaibab map. It's doesn't include the camping designations like Coconino but it may be useful. I also included the link to the Coconino Map for reference.

Good luck and post up a triplog after you get back.

Kaibab National Forest Map - Williams District
https://fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUME ... 436419.pdf

Kaibab National Forest maps page with info for downloading the App
http://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/kaibab/ma ... eprd490027

Coconino National Forest maps page with downloading info
http://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/coconino/ ... rdb5356224

Camping (Coconino)

"Motor vehicle use for the purpose of dispersed camping is permitted only on National Forest System lands within 300 feet of the edge of road segments designated for dispersed camping.
Visitors may also park along the edge of any road shown on this map, and walk to dispersed campsites at any location on National Forest System lands, except where specifically prohibited.
Prohibited locations include those within the city limits of Flagstaff and Sedona, along Oak Creek Canyon, southwest of Kachina Village, near trailheads, and near other developed sites."

The way I interpret this is that the yellow lined roads (or polka-dots, as up by Blue Ridge) allow 300' of perpendicular (to the roadway) vehicle travel in the facilitation of camping/parking. Whereas, unless posted as 'No Camping', camping along any forest roadway is kosher as long as the vehicle is completely off the roadway (presumably somewhere less than 300') and you may walk in your camping gear as far as makes you happy. (Looks like a big opening for these folks > http://www.ergopowercart.com/pages/ergo ... opper.html; or http://www.globalindustrial.com/site/im ... 51339.html

It appears that Kaibab is working on a similar Rube Goldberg system - thankfully they seem to have at least one level-headed voice-of-reason. > https://www.ksl.com/?sid=34424757

I wouldn't camp along FR190 on the last mile to the trailhead, but there's plenty of open space in the general area. Camped plenty of times with no issues.

The links posted by John9L cover everything. HikeAZs assumption is correct.

Both Coconino and Kaibab's travel management rules are pretty simple:

• You are permitted to camp ANYWHERE that it isn't specifically posted that you can't. This usually happens near campgrounds, designated recreation areas (like lakes) and some trailheads (like Kendrick).

• You are PROHIBITED from DRIVING A MOTOR VEHICLE anywhere that isn't a numbered road on the official MVUM map. (See links above.)

• You may ALWAYS park your vehicle WITHIN 30 FEET of an open road. You may camp next to your vehicle anywhere not posted prohibited (or you may walk/hike as far as you want to camp).

• On Coconino NF, there are DESIGNATED CAR CAMPING CORRIDORS where you may park your vehicle UP TO 300 FEET from the designated road. These 300-foot corridors are marked on the map by the yellow highlighting. The Kaibab Forest does not have car-camping corridors and limits all vehicle travel/parking to within 30 feet of an open road.

Here's a link to a Kaibab NF publication on dispersed camping: http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOC ... 313083.pdf

On separate note, Kendrick Mountain is a federally designated Wilderness Area. There is a 12-person group-size limit. Read more about the wilderness here: http://www.wilderness.net/NWPS/wildView ... Management

It's probably worth mentioning that this is a fairly tough hike if you're not in good shape and accustomed to the elevation. Although it's easy enough to bail out and head back down as needed, much of the route gets fairly direct afternoon sun, so the retreat can be quite a slog.

Wow, thank everyone for taking the time to reply. I was hoping for a bit of help, but many of you went above and beyond. I appreciate the info, links, and phone numbers. I'll confirm what I've learned here with Kaibab and post an update.

Yes, Kendrick is a challenging hike for many. I've hiked it a few times, primarily while training to hike the Inca Trail three years ago (I needed the altitude, but I'm not a fan of Humphreys). I've never camped at the summit, but I'm looking forward to it. Often wish there was water up there, but that'd probably make it more crowded. :-)

SonoranCyclist wrote: I've never camped at the summit, but I'm looking forward to it. Often wish there was water up there, but that'd probably make it more crowded. :-)

Be certain to check for widow-makers when camping near the cabin - there is a ton of beetle-kill. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpmrNpqC-Xg
There is (kind of) a spring down the backside on the Bull Basin Trail, maybe 15 min down from the cabin. (It is often just a mud puddle though.)

that ain't mud

hikeaz wrote:Be certain to check for widow-makers when camping near the cabin - there is a ton of beetle-kill. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpmrNpqC-Xg

We were just up there last weekend, and if you are concerned about deadfall (and you should be), I don't think that there is a single safe place to camp on the summit. We stopped for lunch near the little campsite/fire ring just east of the cabin, and we noticed that we were sitting directly under a leaning dead tree that was only being held up by another dead tree. I wouldn't want to be up there on a windy night. Or any night, really. But that's me--the last thing that I do before setting up camp is look around for widowmakers.

There's really not much else for campsites along the trail.

Also, is that the wrong video?

joebartels wrote:that ain't mud

Yep..... it's a nasty mud-looking substance that comes out of the south end of a northbounder. It IS 'filterable' in an extreme pinch though.

hikeaz wrote:Camping (Coconino)............

It appears that Kaibab is working on a similar Rube Goldberg system - thankfully they seem to have at least one level-headed voice-of-reason. > https://www.ksl.com/?sid=34424757

June 27th, 2016-
FLAGSTAFF, Ariz. — A plan to widen hundreds of miles of camping corridors
south of the Grand Canyon would be detrimental to the landscape, according to
state conservationist groups.

Kaibab National Forest officials say popular corridors to the canyon’s South
Rim will be expanded from 30 feet to 300 feet over the next three years. The
move would be a significant change of longtime management rules for the forest
and its paths. The final rule revision is expected later this summer, the
Arizona Daily Sun reported.

The limit is 300 feet in several other forests in Arizona.

The proposal would expand the width on roughly 290 miles of roads. In addition,
it would open access to another 21,000 acres for off-road camping as well as 24
miles of official road within two forest districts.

Environmental groups say off-road vehicles could potentially damage wildlife
habitats, grasslands and other landscape.

“We see unregulated travel at odds with the goals to restore these important habitats,” said Alicyn Gitlin, of the
local Sierra Club. (um...it is not 'unregulated' - it's 300 feet)

Katie Davis, of the Center for Biological Diversity, said a risk of fire across
a greater area could be another after-effect.

Conservation advocates have been closely observing the Kaibab’s travel
management rule-making process since 2005, Davis said. That is when national
forests in the U.S. were told to establish rules for motorized access and
recreation on forest grounds.

The Tonto National Forest recently issued a draft of its final Travel
Management Rule. The Center for Biological Diversity and the Sierra Club are
currently reviewing it.

The change was made because of complaints about initial road limits closing off
campsites that had been used for years, Kaibab spokeswoman Jackie Banks said.

The expanded corridors will be consistent with corridors in the Coconino and
Prescott national forests and eliminate confusion for visitors, she added

@hikeaz
The article you copied above was posted today. Original source linked here for anybody interested: http://azdailysun.com/news/local/enviro ... 5ba6c.html

The "revision project" was implemented in May 2014. The original article (KSL link) was written in June 2015.

All the facts from the horse's mouth:
http://www.fs.usda.gov/project/?project ... p=overview

hikeaz wrote:Kaibab National Forest officials say popular corridors to the canyon’s South
Rim will be expanded from 30 feet to 300 feet over the next three years. The
move would be a significant change of longtime management rules for the forest
and its paths. The final rule revision is expected later this summer, the
Arizona Daily Sun reported.

Someone needs to explain to me why car campers are exempt from leave-no-trace camping rules. If I'm backpacking, and I decide I want to camp somewhere off the trail, every guidance I've ever read tells me to 1) camp in a previously hardened spot or somewhere with no vegetation and 2) avoid disturbing the soil, plants, etc. any more than absolutely necessary.

Why are car campers allowed to drive even 30' off the road, much less 300? Driving your vehicle off-road any more than necessary to clear the road is surely the exact opposite of leave no trace. And car tracks can stay around for a long, long time (like decades) in drier places, assist with spreading invasive species, etc. The NFs in Arizona are FULL of pre-existing dispersed sites.

For anyone who insists on camping away from the road, there is a simple solution: park your car near the road and carry your stuff. Why do we have to sacrifice the soils and vegetation on national forests to people's unwillingness to walk a few feet?

(I look forward to the slings and arrows of the car camping crowd ).

@flagscott
Way to :STP:


As I see it, the NF is the "land of many uses". One of those uses includes motorized recreation (which of course is in no way LNT, and doesn't even pretend to be).

I think that by establishing dispersed camping corridors it encourages use of the forest. For some reason the largely underfunded forest service actually runs advertising to encourage people to go out and "discover the forest". They want to increase use. I suspect it is the only way they can ask for more money. And if the general public goes car camping a lot perhaps there will be more public backing for funding that goes to the forest. If it's only a few tree hugger hikers or backpackers that care, there's no public interest in funding. That's my cynical view of it.

FWIW, I enjoy backpacking and I also appreciate a secluded car camp spot that's off the beaten path and doesn't result in traffic kicking up dust by driving by my tent at all hours of the day and night. And I generally hate developed campgrounds.

I like the idea of camping corridors. It helps serve the needs of different kinds of people with different objectives. It allows for people with young children, elderly, and disabled people to experience a bit of the forest without being stuck on a busy trail or crowded campground.

It's worth noting that the camping corridors are not a green light to drive anywhere you want in those 300 feet. There is still a federal law that prohibits resource damage. You are actually prohibited from driving on an OPEN road when it is muddy and your travel will damage it. Driving over plants, bushes, trees, etc. is similarly prohibited. (36 CFR, §261.12c and §261.15h)

Now if you want to talk about the FS enforcing any of the rules they have in place, and that's a probably whole different thread!
:bdh: