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Herman's Cave - 8 members in 16 triplogs have rated this an average 4.1 ( 1 to 5 best )
16 triplogs
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16 Triplogs
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Mar 11 2018
emilystardust
avatar

 Triplogs 190

37 female
 Joined Jun 23 2015
 Phoenix, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Mar 11 2018
emilystardust
Hiking13.50 Miles 1,680 AEG
Hiking13.50 Miles
1,680 ft AEG
 no routesno photosets
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
Overcast, drizzling morning made for a great day in the Supes. Pretty straightforward hike, only saw a few backpackers out there. The scramble up to the cave was no joke. Clouds broke on the way out, just enough to burn my shoulders. Beautiful, scenic hike.
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Feb 25 2018
The_N
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 Routes 54
 Photos 1,508
 Triplogs 325

33 male
 Joined Mar 18 2015
 Payson, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Feb 25 2018
The_N
Hiking13.50 Miles 1,680 AEG
Hiking13.50 Miles   8 Hrs      1.93 mph
1,680 ft AEG   1 Hour    Break
 no routes
1st trip
Partners none no partners
Accepted an invite to check out a cave I've never heard of, or even noticed while walking by. This allowed me to also walk a couple of stretches of trail in the area that I hadn't recently walked. We started out on Dutchman. Surprisingly quiet morning on the trail. We started seeing backpackers once on Whiskey Spring. The spring was lightly flowing and some decent pools had formed. This entire stretch of Whiskey was in great shape. Once in LaBarge via Red Tanks, we off-trailed it up to the cave. It's an impressive structure, but not useable for anything other than a wildlife hideout. Totally slanted floors give it a cathedral feel. I exited and enjoyed the canyon views while Brittany navigated the cave while attempting to stay upright. We headed back the way we came, and took an extended lunch break in the shade near Whiskey Spring. The rest of the return trip was in full sun, but a breeze and nice temps made it pleansant. All trails were in good shape and easy to follow. We didn't see any one on the trails during the second half of the hike. Surprising for such a nice day.
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If there is no struggle, there is no progress.
Nov 13 2015
wallyfrack
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 Routes 89
 Photos 4,044
 Triplogs 1,233

58 male
 Joined Mar 11 2003
 AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Nov 13 2015
wallyfrack
Hiking18.20 Miles 4,326 AEG
Hiking18.20 Miles   8 Hrs   35 Mns   2.12 mph
4,326 ft AEG
 no routes
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
It's Friday the 13th so take a day off and hike. I've been wanting to get to the true summit on Herman's Mountain but the weekend traffic at the Peralta trailhead kept me away. A weekday visit was the answer. I started late 8a for me but there was plenty of parking. I saw a couple hiking near Miners Summit at that was all until later on the way out. I poked around a few areas on the hike in as focusing on one goal never seems to work. I think I finally located the old wreck site in Whiskey Canyon but still verifying. The hike up south of Trap Canyon onto Herman Mountain always ends up with some scrambling/climbing. I took a detour over above Trap Canyon to look for an old mine from above but the photos didn't turn up anything. The off trail on the mountain is a little rough but fairly open so you can make good time hiking across. There are some ups and downs and a little catclaw to avoid but the views are nice and you have the place to yourself. After hiking all the way across and getting to the ast summit I took some photos and started back. I got cliffed out a few times trying to short cut the exit but after some scrambling I got back on track. I was greeted by a diamondback coming off the ridge above Red Tanks trail. I could tell the rattler was friendly because he kept wagging his tail. :lol: A brief photo session ensued and I was off again. Hiking the trails out was uneventful and I was back at the TH by 4:25p.
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3 archives
Feb 11 2012
joebartels
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 Guides 213
 Routes 824
 Photos 10,880
 Triplogs 4,287

49 male
 Joined Nov 20 1996
 Phoenix, AZ
Dripping Springs Super LoopPhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Feb 11 2012
joebartels
Hiking24.00 Miles 4,044 AEG
Hiking24.00 Miles   12 Hrs   16 Mns   2.38 mph
4,044 ft AEG   2 Hrs   10 Mns Break22 LBS Pack
 
1st trip
After a short squabble with the timid ranger we were off. He paced back and forth twice then came over and asked Bruce to park the car six inches more to the left. We were unaware it's standard procedure to park "between" the posts. I was impressed that Bruce kept it together as he typically has choice verbiage in these situations historically.

51 degree to start in early Feb is gift. I enjoyed Coffee Flat up through Randolph and into Red Tanks Canyon the most. There were some nice wildflower displays in Barkley Basin too. Heading down through Upper La Barge Box it was hot and I wasn't feeling good "heading down" of all things. The wildflowers here are the best of the loop as of now. Well that you walk through anyhow, we saw some sweet distant displays too. Albeit good substantial stretches, I give the entire loop a moderate. Definitely worthy of a trip if you enjoy poppies.

Heading over to La Barge Spring was draggy. We had a late lunch since Bruce wouldn't shut up about "I'm starving" (just a non-stop whiner all day). We started getting the shade advantage pushing "super" past it boundaries to Charlebois. 8+ visit and I still couldn't find the Master Map...lol After talking up Charlebois it was a let down compared to Randolph and Red Tanks Canyon, yet still worthy of the extra jaunt IMO.

I have no clue how Bruce put up with me until this point as I'd been queezy since the start. Then I hit the mojo juice and I was on fire and feeling like a rock star for the finish.

Great loop and Bruce got to see a lot of new territory along the outskirts :y:
wildflower observationwildflower observationwildflower observationwildflower observationwildflower observation
Wildflowers Observation Moderate

water 1 out of 5water less than maxwater less than maxwater less than max Charlebois Spring Dripping Dripping
Large pools as I've always seen. No flow out of the pools.
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Hike Arizona it ROCKS!
Jan 14 2012
WilliamnWendi
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 Guides 2
 Routes 58
 Photos 1,253
 Triplogs 213

46 male
 Joined Dec 26 2009
 Phoenix, Az
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Jan 14 2012
WilliamnWendi
Hiking13.50 Miles 1,874 AEG
Hiking13.50 Miles   9 Hrs   5 Mns   1.74 mph
1,874 ft AEG   1 Hour   20 Mns Break
 
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
Alright who is the resident Coati/mammal expert? Coming up Miner's canyon we saw what I was certain must be a Coati. But after reading up on them now I am not certain. I am certain that it was not a bear unless it was a cub with a monkey like tail. It was definitely not a raccoon or ringtail. I've a few things on-line so far. Coati is not short for Coatimundi which literally translates to "Lone Coati". In general the long-form refers to to adult males who are solitary animals. The mother and pups are considered "Coati". Now the puzzle surrounding my sighting is the coat. The animal we saw was a solid dark, dark brown with maybe an even blacker mask around the eyes, not white that is typical of the darker coated Coati. That version however only adds to the puzzle because that Coati should only be found much further south. Did I get a picture? Yes, after three nearly fatal and failed attempts at trying to jump to the highest point which was a sharply topped boulder that angled out over the canyon, struggling to get at my camera, I got out 3 shots of the typical wildlife photo: A lot of bushes. But good news! After comparing all three photos, and with an Astronomers like precision, I found a tail! It's a dark dark brown and that's my proof. I'll post all three pics.
Continuing up the rocky ankle-threatening Dutchman through Miners Canyon we ran into a group of (7-8) joggers coming down, the courage to do this always amazes me. I kept an eye to the southeast hoping for a glimpse of Buzzards Roost beyond the Coffee Flats. I took a few photos maybe Tibber and crew can help me identify. I had hoped to make the bushwack up to Circle Peak to get an even better view but we ran out of time to do that.
At the top of Miner's Canyon where Whiskey Springs intersects we took our first break. We watched a group of hikers climb up to the base of Miners Needle peak confirming an approach up the south face that I noticed from Barkley Basin. Of course last time I hiked this area I noticed the approach from the north face stemming from the last of Dutchman's switchbacks at the top of Miners Canyon. It would make an interesting loop for another day. Remembering that from this point Whiskey Springs intersection pretty evenly split the Miners Needle loop we decided to and later re-decided not to return on the Bluff Springs portion of that hike. It became apparent that we would run out of daylight coming down Heart-attack Hill and that seemed like bad accident waiting to happen. We did a straight out and back keeping consistent with the hike description.
Before we left a large group of hikers caught up with us. We didn't get to talk to them but they sounded like they were a club and the other half of their group turned out to be the ones on the Needle. Sounded like a fun group.
Whiskey Springs Canyon was pretty. The trail was a little rocky throughout and in portions pretty tightly pruned. Made things a little slow going both ways. The description says there a few nice camping spots. I can confirm, one was down right idyllic, but for being right on the trail.
At the bottom of Whiskey Springs Canyon is the La Barge and the Red Tanks Trail 107, you have to cross Labarge creek. A giant wall juts out from the north wall to pinch Labarge Canyon as you look to the east. Some how I seemed to drawn to it which is good because Herman's Cave is just on the other side of that wall. The Red Tanks trail crosses back over to the other side of creek and cuts high, side stepping house sized boulders before dropping down to the canyon bottom. Keep a sharp eye here because the rail immediately backtracks to the west about 20'. I never saw a low hanging tree like the description talked about but the trail starts heading up the north side of the canyon. At this point if you really look hard enough you'll see Herman's cave hiding on he other side of the wall(It kind of hides until you get far enough east to turn around and look). If you do see it, I would not recommend and you will probably not be tempted to race up the steep gravelly terrain. The trail heads east and gains elevation. About 15' from a wash going down into the canyon is where we found a "trail" only for the fact that it provides somewhat level footing but it was pretty well over grown and blended well into the rest of the growth. There wasn't duck but as we hiked west and cutting across the steep grade we began to see ducks and trampled flora indicating the trail. It's no picnic but it gets you there.
We ate lunch in the cave which for as big as it is doesn't offer a lot of desirable seating but it got the job done and cooled us off at the same time.
Hiking the Red Tanks Trail back was a tempting option but we didn't plan for it so we kept to the plan. Whiskey Springs was much fun going up as it was coming down. I think we lost most of our time in this section. Still we saw at least one jogger so it is obviously easier for some than for others.
Miners Needle never looks more impressive than the view you get dropping down from the saddle.
We reached the trail head just as the last firey clouds began to fade. There we met Lucy who was an off-leash small breed who thought that she was a large breed. She also thought that she wanted to come home with us. Lucy's owner commanded her to get in the car, which she did, except that it was our car! For the next two minutes Lucy jumped from seat to as 4 dumb humans grabbed for her. It was good for a laugh but I just kept waiting for Lucy to "Claim" our car, thankfully she never did.
Named place
Named place
Buzzards Roost
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The Tree of Understanding, dazzling, straight, and simple, sprouts by the spring called Now I Get It. - Wislawa Szymborska, "Utopia"
Dec 02 2011
hikemonk
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 Photos 839
 Triplogs 80

male
 Joined Aug 04 2006
 Gilbert, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Dec 02 2011
hikemonk
Hiking13.50 Miles 1,874 AEG
Hiking13.50 Miles
1,874 ft AEG
 no routes
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
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Dec 26 2010
Dave1
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 Routes 29
 Photos 1,548
 Triplogs 1,802

43 male
 Joined Jan 25 2009
 Phoenix, AZ
Trap CanyonPhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Backpack avatar Dec 26 2010
Dave1
Backpack20.00 Miles 3,800 AEG
Backpack20.00 Miles   10 Hrs   30 Mns   1.90 mph
3,800 ft AEG
 no routes
I wanted to explore Trap Canyon some more so I dragged my wife along and we did an over-night. We camped at the intersection of Whiskey Springs and La Barge Canyons. I wish I hadn't forgotten the tent fly as it was a little breezy and chilly at night. We saw a low of 41F.

We ran into Wally and CO. at the top of Upper La Barge Box. Small world!

I found two more "rooms" in the Trap (or alleged Trap) that I didn't see last time. I could be wrong but I don't think the layout of this place has changed much in a few hundred years. There were some old logs wedged in between the boulders that looked about as old as the floor beams at Cold Spring Canyon. I wish I got a picture of them but my camera was in my pack and I had to leave it behind to squeeze into the rooms. There was a bit more water in the canyon this weekend compared to last. We had to do a hairy up and over climb to get around a pool that wasn't a problem last week. Over-all not bad though. We took about 3 hours to get through Trap Canyon.
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May 24 2010
azdesertfather
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 Guides 12
 Routes 59
 Photos 1,185
 Triplogs 792

45 male
 Joined Apr 30 2008
 Tucson, AZ
Trap CanyonPhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Canyoneering avatar May 24 2010
azdesertfather
Canyoneering18.25 Miles 3,832 AEG
Canyoneering18.25 Miles   9 Hrs      2.03 mph
3,832 ft AEG
A - Dry or little water; shallow or avoidable water; no wet/dry suit
 no routesno photosets
1st trip
Decided to go out last minute, as I have been working way too much lately...and when I saw the high was 81 on a late May day in the Supes, I couldn't resist. Thanks to Bruce & Joe for joining me. Following a tip from Superstition Guy we went out to the east end of Trap Canyon, looking for Jesse. This area is only a few miles from Tortilla TH and has been a draw to Dutch hunters. We didn't find Jesse, although we did find a few articles that I will leave it up to the other guys to explain in more detail.

Most of the water is dried up now, just a few small stagnated pools to be found. Didn't go down to the actual spring at Whiskey, but my guess is it is either a faint trickle or most probably bone dry. The creek bed is totally dry.

As for vegetation, the grasses are pretty much dead now. The foxtail is a total pain, as it's dry and dead and sticks to your socks and shoes like cholla. The worst is, you guessed it, the catclaw. On Whiskey Springs and especially on Red Tanks through the Upper LaBarge Box it was grown over the trail in numerous places. Even a little bit on one stretch of the Hoolie Bacon leading up to the east end of Trap Canyon. There was also plenty of that holly-like bush and also lots of agave and cactus of all sorts right on the trail. No animals of note out today, other than a couple of jackrabbits and plenty of lizards. Did see a couple of snake trails through the sand, but no snakes to be seen today.

Trap Canyon (the eastern end, anyway, which is the only part we saw) was very interesting. Definitely worth a visit if you don't mind a little off trail! Be careful out there though, some of this area is fairly dangerous and if you get hurt out there, it is pretty isolated. Not one to do alone, I would just say.

After heading back uphill on Whiskey Springs, when I came around to the Dutchman I was emotionally ready to be done. I took off, leaving Joe and Bruce to fend for themselves. I did make up for it though by having the car nice and cold for when they arrived back at Peralta.

Took me 9 1/2 hours total, knocking off a 1/2 hour stop for lunch and chat in Trap Canyon.

Thanks guys for a nice final jaunt into the Supes before the heat wave keeps us out for the next several months!
wildflower observationwildflower observationwildflower observationwildflower observationwildflower observation
Wildflowers Observation Moderate
_____________________
"I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately, to front only the essential facts of life, and see if I could not learn what it had to teach, and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived." — Henry David Thoreau
Dec 26 2009
johnlp
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 Guides 1
 Routes 9
 Photos 4,169
 Triplogs 3,237

62 male
 Joined Mar 16 2008
 chandler,az
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Dec 26 2009
johnlp
Hiking14.00 Miles 1,874 AEG
Hiking14.00 Miles   6 Hrs   15 Mns   2.24 mph
1,874 ft AEG
 no routes
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
The hike up to the cave from the Red Tanks trail wasn't as hard as I was expecting. Nice cool day. Not much water around even with the recent rains. Hiked a ways past the cave to see what I could see. Pretty area.
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“Good people drink good beer.” Hunter S Thompson
Jan 27 2008
Vaporman
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 Guides 2
 Routes 4
 Photos 8,687
 Triplogs 931

40 male
 Joined Mar 28 2005
 SLC, Utah
Dripping Springs Super LoopPhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Jan 27 2008
Vaporman
Hiking18.00 Miles
Hiking18.00 Miles   9 Hrs   40 Mns   1.86 mph
 no routes
Well I attempted to hike this loop in the rain no less... :o I woke up Sunday and decided the rain didn't look too bad & the doppler radar showed the rain mostly hitting the westside and heading NE. So I drove to the Peralta TH and still felt good since the skies were still dry and the creeks were as well. Last time I did this loop counter-clockwise, so this time I would go clockwise to mix it up a bit. Started on Dutchman to Whiskey Springs to Red Tanks and up the beautiful Upper La Barge Box with a sidetrip up to Herman's Cave. It started sprinkling below Miner's Needle and started raining harder on my way up to the saddle. It continued raining at a moderate pace for the rest of the day... :roll: After eating lunch at Herman's Cave, I headed back up the trail past Hoolie Bacon towards the Red Tank Divide. The trail is now hugging La Barge Creek again which is flowing rather nicely at this point. I see some cairns that take me up a sidecreek near 'La Barge Spring No 2' on the topo... I'm using my Beartooth map which doesn't have as much detail and is tough to examine with the wind & rain. Well this sidecreek is flowing rather nicely while I'm wading up to my knees & ducking under thick foliage following this random line of cairns... This line of cairns either disappears, is too faint to follow in these conditions, or I just got on some dead end trail... I get out of the creek, wander around a bit trying to sniff out the trail, run across some old campsites & very faint paths, hike a couple ridges/hills to scout of the trail to no avail. :( Decide that at 2pm I need to give up the search and head back the way I came in. So when 2pm rolls around I swallow my pride and hike the 8-9 miles back to the TH. :out: It's uncomfortable enough to be wet and hiking in the rain, I certainly wouldn't want to add dark to the situation. :lol: Those rock hopping creek crossing have now transformed into knee-high wades. Luckily I rolled into the TH around 6pm to enjoy my warm dry vehicle and was able to go thru Upper La Barge Box again.

After getting back and trying to determine what went wrong, I can confirm from the topo on HAZ, google earth, and the GPS track from mcoulter that the actual trail didn't go up that sidecreek and followed La Barge creek just a little longer and was actually on the next ridge over just east of the drainage I was in... Now I've lost trails many times before and have had to backtrack to the last cairn to refind it, but in this situation I would have had to backtrack a few cairns back and look for a totally different set of cairns... :twisted: I feel like rehiking this loop just to destroy those mischievous cairns and better mark the correct path. But even if I would have found the proper trail, much of it would have been in creek/canyons that would have been in possible flash flood conditions. Its funny... I thought that having hiked this trail before would ensure me having an easy time with route finding. :rollH:

Mileage logged is a rough estimate of how far along on the loop I got, sidetrip to the cave, wandering around a bit looking for the trail, and eventually returning back on the route I took in.
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Yea, canyoneering is an extreme sport... EXTREMELY dramatic!!! =p
May 05 2007
wallyfrack
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 Routes 89
 Photos 4,044
 Triplogs 1,233

58 male
 Joined Mar 11 2003
 AZ
Tortilla Super LoopPhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar May 05 2007
wallyfrack
Hiking24.30 Miles 3,500 AEG
Hiking24.30 Miles   11 Hrs      2.21 mph
3,500 ft AEG
 
Partners none no partners
I decided to take advantage of a cool day with a nice breeze and hike the superstitions one more time before the heat rolls in. The weather was perfect. Since I was in a car I parked at the end of FR213 and hiked the 3.1 miles in to the JF trailhead. The trail is lightly used but was easy enough to follow. A few times I got off trail but after backing up a few feet the route was easy to find. The Hoolie Bacon Trail starts about .8 miles from the JF TH and the intersection is marked with signs. The trail gradually gains elevation as it winds through the desert. I saw two white tailed deer but was unable to get photos as they pranced off and stopped it the distance to look back. I did a little side trip into the north end of Trap Canyon but turned back when the bouldering got tricky. I continued on to the Red Tanks trail and headed around Herman's mountain into Upper LaBarge Box. The saguaros are tall and the terrain is wild. I took another side trip up to Hermans Cave and then back down the Red Tanks trail to the Dutchman Trail. Once on the Dutcman trail I decied to check out LaBarge spring which was flowing and the trough was full. I noticed a friendly diamond back as I realized I was just previously standing right next to it but it never rattled or seemed upset in anyway. I took a few photos and left the spring. I pasted the intersection with Peters trail and went into Charlebois Canyon for a look around. I was running out of steam so I cut this trip short and headed back to Peters trail. Once on Peters Mesa the turn around seemed too familiar so I back tracked just to make sure I was on the right trail. The trails were in decent shape and the bush was fairly tame. I wore long pants and sleeves so my wounds were very light. The side trips and road hiking added about 8.2 miles to my route. I was glad to finally make it to FR213 and finish the last 3.1 miles back to the car.
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2 archives
Dec 31 2006
nonot
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 Guides 93
 Routes 236
 Photos 1,969
 Triplogs 476

male
 Joined Nov 18 2005
 Phoenix, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Dec 31 2006
nonot
Hiking 1,874 AEG
Hiking
1,874 ft AEG
 no routes
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
Logged under Whiskey-Springs Red Tanks Trail.
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http://hikearizona.com/garmin_maps.php

Hike Arizona it is full of sharp, pointy, ankle-twisting, HAZmaster crushing ROCKS!!
Hike Arizona it is full of sharp, pointy, shin-stabbing, skin-shredding plants!
Hike Arizona it is full of striking, biting, stabbing, venomous wildlife!
Mar 09 2005
hikngrl
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 Triplogs 85

female
 Joined Feb 26 2003
 Peoria, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Mar 09 2005
hikngrl
Hiking13.50 Miles 1,874 AEG
Hiking13.50 Miles
1,874 ft AEG
 no routesno photosets
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners partners
jw63
I got to go hiking yesterday! Finally after what seems like many weeks I got to go hiking. I went with Jim to play in the Supes! It was so much fun! We departed from Peralta TH and took the Lost Dutchman trail.

While on the Dutchman we took a little irresistible side trip to go play in the drainage then up the side of the mountain to go play around and see how close we could get to the arch that we have all so often seen to your left. The one we all have pictures of. The one I have wanted to try and get to oh so many times. That's the one, and since I was with JW I got my chance yesterday! We got oh so close but no cigar. We climbed some crack and some huge boulders and squeezed through a small scree chute and got just around the corner from the arch with only a huge drop off and a cliff face between us and the arch. the growth on the mountain side was wicked! The cat claw laid claim to much flesh and I left approximately two gallons of blood on the mountain side....Poopie! Another day another time....

After our attempt to reach the arch was thwarted we then moved over and climbed up to the shoulder behind the arch. That was fun and a tough climb from our vantage point. We later found out as we headed down that there was a much easier route but the one we took was way fun!

So we then got back on trail and headed up to Whiskey Springs trail. The water is slow but it is still plentiful. Whiskey spring is running beautifully. You have to climb through some over growth to get to it but of course we did. I have to say I have never seen the Supes in such fine form before! The green, the flowers, the water.... The grandeur was almost more than one could take in all at one time. I will sorely miss all of this when summers heat burns it all away! Many creek crossings made our trip oh so much fun!

JW showed me a couple of small camp sites that I some day hope to make use of as I have yet to over night any where in the Supes! Any one who wants to go with me to take care of that little over site just let me know!

Eventually we came to the junction of Whiskey Springs and Red Tank and took Red Tank to the right. I have never been in this section of the Supes before and was enjoying it immensely! There is so much to see out there! We took Red Tank as far as a really cool cave up above to your left. One that many would point at and say "Oh cool!" Guess what we did?

Yep, that's right! We climbed up to said cave and hung out for a while watching the birds fly in and out of their cave. I say their cave because they made it quite obvious that we were invading their territory... after a few minutes of us just sitting quite and still they calmed again and resumed flying in and out trusting that we were not going to harm them. We watched them fly in and around the cave and when they figured out we weren't going to bother them they started disappearing into the ceiling of the cave through small holes in the rock. It was amazing how they could be flying along and then just at the right split second they turned abruptly and flew through that tiny little hole!

It was so beautiful and serene in there. I so easily could have taken a nap right there! However, had I fallen asleep and rolled over in my sleep I would have been one unhappy camper as the floor to the cave was at a downward slant through out the entire cave. There were shelves inside the cave that one could just imagine a nice large size feline lying on wagging her tail as she watched the birds fly in and out.

Though we would have liked to go further after the cave I suddenly discovered that I was severely short on water so we headed back out the way we came leaving further exploration for yet another day. On the way back out we stopped again at Whiskey Spring and got a nice cold drink and rinse some grunge off in the shower of the spring. That was so very refreshing and reminiscent of playing in the springs on the Paria trip!

The last creek crossing of the day was just a few feet before we reached the trail head. I went back after I shed my boots to clean up and soak my feet for a few minutes.... it felt so good!

We made it back out with out incident and despite the fact that I miss calculated my water needs for the very first time in my hiking experience together we had plenty of water and neither of us suffered. Needless to say I had a really great time yesterday and can't wait to get back out again! Thanks JW63!
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~~~Diane~~~
Feb 23 2003
glenntm
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 Photos 31
 Triplogs 25

56 male
 Joined Dec 18 2002
 Gilbert, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Backpack avatar Feb 23 2003
glenntm
Backpack13.50 Miles 1,874 AEG
Backpack13.50 Miles2 Days         
1,874 ft AEG
 no routes
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
Great hike. Had 9 scouts, and 6 adults. Boys enjoyed the cave :lol:

No water at Whiskey Springs, but great time. Boys would like to go again. This was a good packpacking trip for their second time out. Weather was great. 70's during the day, and low-40's in the evening. Camped about 5.6 miles in at Whiskey Spring. Nice area that was shaded, and had plenty to keep the boys busy.
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Dec 27 2002
glenntm
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 Photos 31
 Triplogs 25

56 male
 Joined Dec 18 2002
 Gilbert, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Dec 27 2002
glenntm
Hiking13.50 Miles 1,874 AEG
Hiking13.50 Miles   7 Hrs   30 Mns   1.80 mph
1,874 ft AEG
 no routes
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
_____________________
Jan 10 2002
Fritzski
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 Guides 43
 Photos 597
 Triplogs 59

66 male
 Joined Feb 04 2002
 Gilbert, AZ
Herman's CavePhoenix, AZ
Phoenix, AZ
Hiking avatar Jan 10 2002
Fritzski
Hiking 1,874 AEG
Hiking
1,874 ft AEG
 no routes
1st trip
Linked none no linked trail guides
Partners none no partners
After having just returned From Clay Worst's 'Dutchman' presentation for the Superstition Mountain Historical Society, I learned a couple things.

First, although Waltz did actually enter the mountains from what is the present day Quarter Circle U Ranch, the allignment of the trail actually went up the west side of Miners Needle instead of the east as it does today. Also, no one is actually sure as to where he went from the top of Miners Needle. Some think east to LaBarge as mentioned above, others think west toward the Needle Canyon area. Good luck! :)
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average hiking speed 2.02 mph

WARNING! Hiking and outdoor related sports can be dangerous. Be responsible and prepare for the trip. Study the area you are entering and plan accordingly. Dress for the current and unexpected weather changes. Take plenty of water. Never go alone. Make an itinerary with your plan(s), route(s), destination(s) and expected return time. Give your itinerary to trusted family and/or friends.

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