Dr. Earle Spamer has posted extensive bibliographies dealing with the Grand Canyon that will be useful to anyone who loves learning about The Canyon. https://ravensperch.org/the_grand_canon/ This is not meant to send participation away from this forum but to trigger topics to discuss here. Of course...

Dr. Earle Spamer has compiled an extensive list of resources on 'Grand Canyon Maps' and published in 2022 (after Chum's initial posting) via his website: https://ravensperch.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Mapping_Grand_Canyon.pdf I'll post his webpage under a separate heading since his research has ...

I'd suggest that, after observing all the responses you've been getting, that you'd mute yourself, if you had some self-awareness. Only a small subset of the forum members. My guess is that most don't want to get in the cross-fire and deal with the attacks for sharing their opinion---especially sin...

If that means they gotta cut down on the booze or carry salt packets or nuun with them, then so be it. Pretty demeaning view of firefighters. I dare you to walk into a fire station or go to the front lines where 1000's are fighting wild fires and share your opinion with them. I looked up the requir...

@ShatteredArm

ShatteredArm wrote:I don't have any questions for you, other than, why do you think we're all a bunch of idiots?

Seriously, I'm not interested in what you think you know about exercising in hot weather. I have a lot of experience doing i

Put me on 'Ignore'

Response to Shatterarm, Yes, the biggest factor in heat-related illness is the heat you generate yourself. When there are extreme external environmental heat factors, your body cannot cool itself (mostly via sweating) enough to expel the internal heat. If you have a heart-attack, it is your heart th...

@chumley

You should contact the doctors who took care of those in the hospital with your wisdom. Perhaps they will change the diagnosis and the whole business about closing trails during periods of Extreme Heat Index will be taken care of. (PS---your comment was my best laugh from this thread.)

No data was presented establishing the cause of the injuries to rescue personnel, nor those people who were being rescued during the incidents. From Thoreau's original post: "This appeal comes nearly one month after 12 members of the fire department’s Technical Rescue Team were sent home for h...

This is such a pointless comment, it's like saying it's too hot to go running on the surface of the sun. Like, no crap, of course everybody has a limit, but that doesn't mean you need to be jealous of those who are more heat-acclimated than you are, and denigrate them with insults like "adrena...

sidhayes wrote:Perhaps this question has already been asked and answered ,but is the NPS liable for injuries/deaths?

Good question. http://www.georgewright.org/1302breen.pdf

http://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/o ... -35287.pdf

The basics of Search-and-Rescue helicopters:

https://mra.org/wp-content/uploads/2019 ... _Basic.pdf

@azbackpackr I never said the tour bus company was going to take a group hiking. I never said that a tour bus company was telling people to go hike the Bright Angel. I have seen a tour bus swing by the BCO and drop off backpackers/hikers who are going in to pick up a permit. Tour buses routinely pa...

Unless you are from Krypton and have an “S” on your chest and wear a cap, the Heat Index applies to EVERYONE. We all have a crash-point where we will suffer the impacts of physical exertion in extreme heat. Those who are heat-acclimated and in great physical conditioning can last a little longer—it ...

@chumley Pardon my confusion but you stating this surprises me. You have explained the scientific basis supporting limiting human activity based on heat. I’m interested in the data points that cause you to now feel conflicted on this topic. There's no easy answers for the NPS. They are dealing with ...

nonot Good post and link. The backcountry NPS staff that I have talked to are conflicted on the issue. As you point out, a good number are upset/angry over the many carry-out rescues off the BA; others think that the Canyon should be accessible and not 'dumbed-down' to the least among us. There's a ...

@friendofThundergod Ok in the last week you have accused me of being a big game hunter trolling forums to find trophy sheep and now the "young testosterone and adrenalin-fueled male" comment. Do you even read my triplogs bro? Or are you just a long winded forum lurker? Please take a look ...

fyi. The decision regarding closing trails in Phoenix was made without regard to any of whatever you contributed above. Did you not read Thoreau's original article? You certainly didn't read all the material I posted. My posting went up at 8;56 and you're posting at 9:47. Here's from the original i...

now its starting to look like our greatest threat to public land and access may come from arbitrary closures by local, state and federal entities in their efforts to protect the lowest common denominators walking among us. Thanks for providing the link to the dangers of helicopter rescue in extreme...

I can't wait for those gates to go in at the top of the Grand Canyon to prevent hiking below the rim on the 100 or so days of year a heat advisory is issued. A few years ago NPS did attempt a gate across the BA trail to warn day hikers. At the mile-an-half rest house they had a swinging gate that e...

@Canyonram It was crazy this year! And I'm sure it was at least 4-5 separate individuals because they were different sizes ... most often saw them just walking across the main park road - I always watched and made sure they made it safely across. 🙂 You might have your version of 'Snake Road' in Sha...