Luddite seeks...

[Hansenaz]

There's been plenty of commentary in the forum about the pros and cons of the powerful all-in-one gps/camera/phone technology. I've resisted so far, satisfied with separate gps, camera and phone units. But now I'm confronted with needing a new camera (mine broke) and a new car (mine got old and beat up and needs a lot of work now).

I'm reluctant to just replace my ca. $450 camera, and while I like having a NAV system in my car I'm reluctant to pay an extra $2K for one in a new car. I could solve both these problems (as well as replace my unloved GPS), with a smartphone. That's a big step but thinking about it, my main problem is I don't want to pay Verizon (or whoever $50+ / month) for the rest of my life. I do like the idea of having a great piece of hardware that could do all this for a bargain price (example: iPhone 8 < $300, and I notice @Johnlp takes beautiful pictures with one).

The main question for me is the gps for the car. Everyone uses theirs nowadays connected to a cell tower and I know that outperforms all the built-in car gps units. But how would this work in airplane mode? I figure we have a world expert in airplane mode navigation running this website, and many other knowledgeable users. Well?

BTW I know that it's inevitable that this all works better when you pay T-Mobile (or whoever). But if airplane mode car navigation can actually work (as well as it did in my previous crappy built-in gps) then I've got a reason to look into smartphone tech as I address my current camera and car problems.

[hikerdw]

@Hansenaz The wife and I both have iPhones with a data plan via Boost for a flat $55 a month for both. Neither of our cars have navigation, hers is older and doesn’t have Apple CarPlay so she just uses her phone directly for navigation assistance. The Subaru does have Apple CarPlay and once the phone is connected displays the phone map on the car display. I’m not sure how or if it would work without a data plan though.

[LosDosSloFolks]

@Hansenaz DON"T DO IT!!! It's a trap! Just kidding...I'm in the same boat and about to make the plunge into the 20th century also. The voice quality on my flip phone is so good...I'm gonna miss it. Smart phones seem to do everything so well with the exception of using them as a phone for talking to another person. Here I come Facey-Tweets!

[wildwesthikes]

I advise you to look into Visible Wireless. $40/mo flat. Unlimited everything with no data caps and no throttling. If you do a party plan you can get it down as low as $25/mo. It uses Verizons LTE backbone (actually I believe they are in part owned by Verizon).

If you want to add a capable and optically decent zoom to the phone you end up getting, look into Moment Lenses.

I previously said on another thread about this topic every smartphone built since 2007 has a GPS chip in it. You'll want an offline car navigation app. There are dozens. Google's own app works fine for me but you have to tell it which areas of the world you want it to download to your phone. I have pretty much full offline coverage of most of the southwest on my phone. When it loses cell reception it continues using an offline map if you have it on the device. They use GPS 100% of the time. Cell towers are used to improve the GPS signal through tower triangulation. In airplane mode it uses just GPS - same as your Garmin. That's how I navigate in the backcountry currently.

[wildwesthikes]

@hikerdw
I have an older iPhone 6s that I held onto for the specific purpose of a backup car navigation device in case the phone I take on hikes takes a permanent plunge into a lake or off a cliff. I tested to makes sure I could get things to work without cell service on it. I found the best way to make this happen is to keep it on airplane mode at all times. With iPhones, you can tell it to keep WiFi enabled while on airplane mode

(put it in airplane mode first, then re-enable wifi from the dock tab thing, whatever... you know the thing that has controls on it when you swipe down)

This effectively just turns off the cell radio but keeps Wifi & GPS enabled. You can use the Wifi on it at home or wherever you have internet to download offline maps. Then when you take it into the backcountry you can put it on "full" airplane mode to save it from searching for any cell tower or wifi radio signals and use it just like a regular GPS device so to speak.

[chumley]

@Hansenaz
While there are inexpensive or pay-as-you-go options for cellular service, as @wildwesthikes mentioned there are also numerous mapping apps that work just fine without any cellular service. The key to using them is making sure that you load maps onto to the phone when you are at home on wifi before you head out. Technically this is what in-car navigation systems have done (usually by way of DVD or other media) in the past. The maps are loaded to the in-car nav device, and your location is dynamically placed on those maps via gps location.

[Hansenaz]

Thanks @hikerdw, @losdosslofolks, @wildwesthikes, and @chumley...all good inputs. Forget the cell service for now (I have a pay as you go at the moment, I just don't use it except for the odd phone call). Just focussing on the airplane mode car navigation: so I know there are a lot of map apps and that you can even download from Google Maps. So my real question was can you load all of AZ (and maybe more) and does it work well enough? Sounds like the consensus is yes, though no one really works this way. Correct? Downside, no real time traffic info - I don't have that with my car NAV now anyway.

If I have it right I'd skip paying for the car OEM NAV and buying a new camera and instead put money into a phone. I might even learn Route Scout!

Even Luddites can learn...I've discovered Youtube channels during the pandemic. Was watching wildwesthikes this morning...good work!

[chumley]

phone call

wth is that!?
https://www.theonion.com/report-only-3- ... 1820611008

[The_Eagle]

@Hansenaz
Steve, i use Android Auto in my Subaru with google maps. Navigation/Maps are ported to the cars display. I have the Az maps loaded for when im out of cell range. Data use is minimal. When im going to a Th that is not in google maps, i go into Google Maps on my computer the night before and "drop a pin" where i plan to park. When driving i can navigate to that point. There are quite a few popular THs in google maps that you can navigate to by saying "Okay google, directions Peralta Trail Head" and the turn by turn directions show up on the map.

[LindaAnn]

If you’re talking about navigating to trailheads, forest roads, etc, you can just create a track in Route Editor to follow for the drive in RouteScout. That’s what I do, typically from the time I leave a major road all the way to where I want to park. Obviously, you have to know where you’re going ahead of time in order to create the track, but then you can just follow it (in airplane mode) while you’re driving.

General highway/road trip type driving, I’m lazy and just use apple maps if I need directions. I still carry maps in my vehicles though, so I don’t often use apple maps unless I want to check current traffic/road conditions.

[The_Eagle]

@LindaAnn
@Hansenaz
Linda, I used RS for my TH directions in the past, exactly as you described.
New cars have that new fangled big screen. If it's Apple Carplay or Android Auto enabled, why not use it. You then have the ability to use all the google/apple maps features. ie. accident/traffic rerouting, gas stations, restaurants, etc.
Another plus is you have the maps cached in case your plans change... without cell service.

[big_load]

he main question for me is the gps for the car. Everyone uses theirs nowadays connected to a cell tower and I know that outperforms all the built-in car gps units. But how would this work in airplane mode? I figure we have a world expert in airplane mode navigation running this website, and many other knowledgeable users. Well?

BTW I know that it's inevitable that this all works better when you pay T-Mobile (or whoever). But if airplane mode car navigation can actually work (as well as it did in my previous crappy built-in gps) then I've got a reason to look into smartphone tech as I address my current camera and car problems.

Being connected to the cell phone network doesn't make your GPS any more accurate, given the right algorithm it just speeds up how quickly you get an initial fix. After that location performance is pretty much indistinguishable. The network connection also allows real-time map data updates, which can be good or bad depending on how carefully (or not) you set things up.

[Hansenaz]

@big_load
Yes...understood. I'm just thinking it's attractive to buy (at a reasonable price) a nice combo camera/gps gadget that doesn't need a contract or cell tower connection.
If it turns out it can also be used as a phone and do a lot more with an internet connection, well I might want to look into that eventually. ;-)