$8+ gas by June?

[Jim]

Gas is up to $4.50 in Maranara, and I'm sure well over that in the Valley and Flagstaff. Some places out of state are already well over $6. However, in Arizona we are still not yet seeing $5+ as a common price, if at all.

Should this change, will you be likely to alter or change summer travel plans?

I'm considering dropping a trip to the Cabeza Prieta in the next month due to prices, as I can still go next winter if they drop. However, this was in a framework of prices dropping in a few months and prices being more reasonable come summer. If gas around here is $8 on average by June, $4.50 will seem cheap, and I will wish I at least did my desert trip.

My goal this summer was to go to the White Mountains in California, a region not exactly known for cheap gas, so I probably wouldn't do that if it was at $9 or $10/gallon in western Nevada and far east California. Wouldn't drive to eastern Montana or North Dakota, either. Maybe I would visit Flagstaff, instead? Maybe I would just go to the Angle Orchard and gorge on peaches?

[Jim]

It's times like this I am glad I can get 30 mpg, but when it was 1.99, I wished I had an FJ. Never really needed one, just as I do not need (or want) a Tacoma or 4Runner, but 1/10th of a percent of the time it might be fun to have. That said, something that handles well and is a bit more fun to drive for the other 99.99% of the time would be better, still.

Everyone has a breaking point for everything, at some point. Maybe it isn't $5/gallon, maybe it is $8/gallon. The longer this lasts, the more that gets affected, and eventually it will collapse. Maybe that is the goal, I don't know. I do know that in the 2008 collapse there were 2 things that caused it. Housing being one thing, and we're seeing similar run ups in home price, and fuel costs were the other. If the economy stalls, more than it is now, due to rising energy costs, there will be cut backs, and eventually people will start to lose jobs. This in turn will stress the mortgage payments ability, and with home prices already inflated, that might lead to falling home prices, maybe a collapse. I'm not saying we have another subprime crisis looming, just that if momentum swings, things aren't going to get better. They will get worse.

[chumley]

what my ride service costs me

This method may be more successful when heading southbound

[hikeaz]

Gasoline/Diesel is one thing (just think of all the things delivered by air (including people), rail and truck for a sec as well).
As much as TNF and other gear/clothing manufacturers posture about climate change, every single thing they make originates with oil. How about all that Styrofoam for takeout? What about all the plastic in vehicles, including trailers/RV's? Carpet? Window frames? Most casual/athletic shoes & clothing? This egregious oil mismanagement co$ts Americans at every turn.

[DixieFlyer]

I do not need (or want) a Tacoma or 4Runner

a lot of people say that, but it's funny, when they want me to give them a ride to a 4WD-only TH all of a sudden they love Taco's and 4Runners

yeah, my gas mileage sucks, but I can go hiking to a lot of places that I could not go otherwise

[DixieFlyer]

Should I mention that if I do go to California, I will make all efforts to travel in Nevada, avoid California as much as possible, stay in NV, and limit my money spending in California as much as possible? I did.

I have cancelled one CA trip -- I'd just as soon not spend money in communist states. I will still do one hike in CA in the near future, but it is one that I can get to from Vegas or Kingman, and not have to spend a penny in CA.

[outdoor_lover]

While I don't have buyer's remorse, I'm kinda missing my Escape right about now.... 36 gallons at a time kinda smarts a bit.

[chumley]

@DixieFlyer the state sales tax is 7.25% in CA. Additional sales taxes may be added by local jurisdiction. Contributing a dollar out of my lunch to the communists doesn't make me change my hiking plans. I'm happy add a couple of pennies to the local communities I usually visit which are generally represented by very non-communist folks. As a side note, Nevada's sales tax is 4.6%. But in Vegas it's 8.3% ... because the very communist Clark County takes its share. I don't set up shop and earn taxable income while on hiking trips, so my lifetime-to-date contributions to other local governments are probably less than a single bar tab. I usually top off a tank in Arizona before crossing into California, but I do it because it's less expensive, not because how the extra few bucks will be wasted there.

[LindaAnn]

I generally avoid CA as much as possible, for many reasons.

This chart is eight months old, so may be slightly outdated, but as of July 2021, every gallon of gasoline purchased in CA was taxed about $0.85

[Jim]

@DixieFlyer
I know that I would only partly avoid Commiefornia due to gas prices and taxes. Plenty of other really good reasons to stay out of most places in that state. After I posted that, I was wondering what kind of restrictions they may still have in the area. Dave Rubin was in LA and was refused service since he didn't have his "papers". I won't even go near that state if that is how they are doing things.

[DixieFlyer]

@Jim_H
yeah, sales tax rates are the least of my concerns and issues with CA

[eru]

People upset about government handouts and welfare should petition the AZ state government to pay off the billions they owe the Feds for the subsidized water flowing into Phoenix (CAP etc), and have them return half of the federal tax dollars that come in!

AZ gets nearly $2 back for every $1 paid in federal taxes, CA gets only 95c - it's amusing that "communist" states like CA & NY (and the national debt) end up handing out welfare to more the ones that identify as libertarian (Montana gets $1.50 back for every dollar in taxes, 1/4 of the population is on medicaid, etc). AZ is around the tenth state most dependent on the federal government, CA is around the 45th... but somehow AZ is independent...? My step-dad is a libertarian and thinks that subsidies for solar & climate change etc are bad, but has no issue with the welfare water coming out of his tap lol. TX is one of the few red states which is fiscally indepedent on a governence level.

Another thing I've really realized in the pandemic is that it's really counties vs states when you're thinking of red vs blue in terms of culture - in the grocery stores in Mammoth everyone was masking up pre-vaccines, in Sonora maybe 2/3, in Crescent City all the older white males either had masks around their chins or with their noses hanging out. One was drunk midday shouting in the store, and another backed into my vehicle in the parking lot and sped off. A lot of residents in Bishop were afraid that Teh Antifa was going to bus in rioters from LA during the BLM protests (which from a purely detached tactical perspective would make no sense) - it's an interesting town of granola climber dirtbaggers and cranky old cowboy types.

re: current gas prices in Bishop & the station between Lone Pine & Big Pine they're still cheaper than gas further north and south on 395.

[Jim]

Oh, here comes $8 to $10/ gallon gas.

[Jim]

People upset about government handouts and welfare should ...

I did not see anyone make any kind of statements in the thread such as that. Where are you getting this claim from?

[eru]

@Jim_H rants about never stepping foot into commiefornia etc were off topic as well.

Just pointing out that CA & AZ actually have a very communist relationship that AZ benefits from - CA contributes according to it’s ability and AZ gets subsidized according to it’s need. I guess there’s a non hypocritical place for people that are fine with that financial dependent relationship (and of AZ being a welfare state) but upset about social issues, but the emphasis on communism made me think of socioeconomic structures.

[Jim]

@eru
But literally, no one made such a claim.

Some people have a problem with unconstitutional mandates, authoritarianism, and that kind of thing. Like I said, I will not drop a cent in that state if I can help it. I don't even care if the gas is cheaper in a California Indian Reservation, I'll buy it in Nevada.

However, it sounds like I will be no where near California, as $4 is going to look very cheap in a month.

[azbackpackr]

Closer to the topic... (surprised? ): I think I will not do as many expensive trips next fall. I save for those during my summer work season. This past fall I spent time driving to Florida and a couple of months there--Nov-Dec--and driving back. For me, that was a pretty expensive trip. I won't be doing that again. Nor will I fly to Hawaii as I had planned for the coming fall. I may go to Florida again, because of family who moved there, but I will fly, if I can afford it.

There are always all kinds of adventures available close to home.

[chumley]

@azbackpackr
Personal budgets are highly individualized. The percentage of ones income spent on automobile fuel is pretty low for most people. But if your budget is constrained, it's not uncommon for non-work travel to be a place to cut costs. Most people can't make a significant reduction in their base expenses, whereas "extravagances" such as travel, eating out, buying hiking or backpacking gear, permits, etc. are "low-hanging fruit".

Of course everybody has different priorities. For some, notching the thermostat up 10 degrees this summer will be preferred over not going on that backpacking trip in the Winds.

People are different.

[DixieFlyer]

However, in Arizona we are still not yet seeing $5 as a common price, if at all.

The regular gas price near me is $4.59 per gallon

[LindaAnn]

@DixieFlyer Pretty much all the stations I’ve noticed in Ahwatukee are $4.59, with one typically more expensive station at $4.85

Prices in trading yesterday were actually down quite a bit, although one day doesn’t really matter a whole lot.

[Jim]

@DixieFlyer
I would stock up. $5 will seem cheap by summer. Prices have been going up since January 2021. I wonder why? Oh, why?