Lighters

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 01 2004 9:52 pm

I tend to carry a butane "blow torch" style lighter. I don't smoke but keep it on my pocket all the times. Just a habit I picked up. The problem I have with these lighters is the last two I had would not work if they were cold. I'm not talking freezing or anything just below 60 degrees. I have to warm it with my hands before they would light. I wonder if I'm doing something wrong or if this is just a flaw with this style of lighter. The cheap Bic ones will still work under these conditions. Doesn't make sense.

Lizard · Post by **Lizard** » Jan 02 2004 8:02 am

I believe that blowtorch style lighters use pressurized gas to make flames. Pressurized gas becomes finicky and difficult in cold weather. This is also a performance problem with stoves that use pressurized gas (like butane or propane/butane mix). This is especially true as the stove cartridge becomes well used, because the pressure drops off as the cartridge empties.

You can fix it by topping off your lighter with one of those cans of butane you can buy at most convenience stores. As a temporary solution when this happens out in the wilderness, try warming the lighter with body heat. Butane gas expands when heated, so warming the stove may give you enough pressure to get it to work. Or you could just buy a Bic lighter, which as you mentioned does not share these problems.

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 02 2004 9:13 pm

What about the Zippo lighters? How would you rate them for outdoor use? Are there issues with them?

Lizard · Post by **Lizard** » Jan 05 2004 11:25 am

A zippo will work fine for outdoor use. However they are heavier than comparable lighters.

pfredricks · Post by **pfredricks** » Jan 05 2004 11:43 am

Hope this helps-
I had this conversation elsewhere recently, when I advocated the use of the mini Bic lighters (carry two)
BoyNhisDog recommended carrying a Ferrocium rod (the sparker on a firestarter) and some vaseline dipped cotton balls-in something like a plastic film container.
THis is supposed to burn hot for a couple minutes and be pretty hot.

Subsequent folks have agreed this works very well.

My experience is that zippos have a bit of trouble at altitude and the cold- Bics seem to work better.

-Pete

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 05 2004 6:02 pm

I carry two Bic mini-lighters. One is in my stove and one is in my cooking pot. I only worry about them breaking. They are disposable after all. I have used other fire starters but I don't think they would work well for just starting my stove. Again there appears to be no magic bullet to solve all my concerns.

Your posts are really appreciated. Replys always make me go in new directions that I didn't consider on my own.

I'm really going to make a huge effort not to have any camp fires on any of my trips this year. I think the "no trace" camping/backpacking is very important. Seems impossible to do completely though.

pfredricks · Post by **pfredricks** » Jan 06 2004 8:24 am

My experience is that Bics are nearly indestructible.

You could also get a stove with a piezo lighter!!!

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 06 2004 6:20 pm

I thought about that. Are they reliable though?

pfredricks · Post by **pfredricks** » Jan 06 2004 7:26 pm

I wouldnt rely on it as your sole source of fire(piezo) but doesnt hurt to have anyway.

two bics will cover you though

Daryl · Post by **Daryl** » Jan 07 2004 11:00 am

I carry a mini bic and coleman water proof matches as a backup. Never had a problem with either.
I've tested the coleman water proof matches and they work fine when wet. I was impressed.

For fire starter I carry a few small squares I cut from an old bike inner tube. I think I got that tip from someone on here. I've tested that trick and it works great. Once the square is lit it burns pretty hot for awhile, plenty to start a good fire.

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 07 2004 6:26 pm

"For fire starter I carry a few small squares I cut from an old bike inner tube. I think I got that tip from someone on here. I've tested that trick and it works great. Once the square is lit it burns pretty hot for awhile, plenty to start a good fire."

That's one I have never heard of. I have to test that out. You could pack quite a few of those and they would have a shelf life.

Abe · Post by **Abe** » Jan 07 2004 8:07 pm

I carry my BIC lighter. Nothing like flicking my BIC starting my campfire. Also, overkill, I do carry matches as well.

Daryl wrote:For fire starter I carry a few small squares I cut from an old bike inner tube. I think I got that tip from someone on here. I've tested that trick and it works great. Once the square is lit it burns pretty hot for awhile, plenty to start a good fire.

However, I do like the inner tube idea. Never heard of it but I'll give it a try.

Daryl · Post by **Daryl** » Jan 08 2004 10:59 am

It takes a little bit to get it lit (it took me two matches when I tried it), but once lit it burns nicely for awhile.

I've never used any other fire starter so I'm curious how others would compare how well it works.

te_wa · Post by **te_wa** » Jan 08 2004 4:04 pm

dofear, as a casual smoker I would never recommend using a Zippo for firestarting, reason being that they are too finicky and keeping them full of gas seems a hassle. Ive owned 2 of 'em and could never light 'em after a week or so of sitting, seems the fuel evaporates. And then there is the problem with the lid getting in the way. They are simply designed for smoking and not much more, I guess.

you might consider me a nut because I carry at least two bic lighters, a signal mirror for firestarting just in case, and a piezo stove also.

and GUYS....Im ashamed of you. Dont you know the BEST firestarter in the world?? its cheap, indestructable, always in season, and burns slow but hot. After using this stuff and seeing what results it can produce in all but the worst conditions, I will never go back. STEEL WOOL. 'nuff said.

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 08 2004 6:29 pm

I have used steel wool. Gives good results.

EC_hiker · Post by **EC_hiker** » Jan 09 2004 2:17 am

Any butane lighter is under pressure and uses this pressure in order to force the butane out of the lighter, whether it's blowtorch-style or regular.

The issue is, the butane has to vaporize before it can burn. Butane expands and vaporizes more readily at higher temperatures, so when it's cold the butane doesn't vaporize as readily. This is compounded by higher altitudes as the lighter burns 'leaner' due to the less dense air. A lot of this can be minimized by keeping the lighter warm by leaving it in your pocket or something. Is the blowtorch type of lighter that you got one of the cheapie Circle-K fodder things? That may be the real issue.

The biggest problem with Zippos is that they leak, and even if they don't leak, the fuel tends to evaporate, leaving you high and dry so to speak.

My experience is that inner tube pieces work great as firestarters once you get them lit. Even better than cutting squares though: cut a cross-section of the inner tube to make big honkin' rubber bands. That way you can use them as... well... big honkin' rubber bands.

mikeinFHAZ,

I'm somewhat of a pyro myself. Usually when I go hiking, I carry a regular lighter, matches, a blowtorch lighter, and a ferrocerium rod with tinder. Plus you've gotta figure in the magnifying glass on my Swiss Army Knife.

You mentioned that you carry "a signal mirror for firestarting just in case". I too carry a signal mirror, but how do you manage to start a fire with a mirror? Did I miss something in the Hiker Instruction Manual?

ADGibson · Post by **ADGibson** » Jan 09 2004 7:10 pm

The last one I carried was actually a nice one from Eddie Bauer. Kinda ticks my off that it doesn't work very well in the cold.