Mid May South and North Rim Weather

[KwaiChang]

Hi Kids - looking for advice about the need for step ins for ice on the SK and NK in Mid May. Will start my hike on the SK May 15th - down to PR - then up NK on the 16th thru the 18th then down NK and up BA. The sensible person in me says pack them ya might need em - but what is the general experience? Will I need them or are they going for a nice hike? ;)

[KwaiChang]

excellent book, excellent authors
http://hikearizona.com/books.php?REV=1&ID=77

Ahhhhh but to have 250 green backs for that coffee table book!!! Def gonna snag the paperback as Dr. Butchart is a legend to me! I can only hope to be hiking at same age he was - PLUS he was one lucky SOB t that the Canyon as his personal playground. Can you imagine paddling across the Colorado on a blow up raft - the Park Rangers would straight jacket you these days!

[nonot]

Kwai, read through your log. You have picked a well-travelled route. It will be easy except for your plan to go from Phantom to the north rim, that day will be a bit long and tough for you, so I'd recommend you start early on that day and bring lots of snacks (and eat them often too on that day).

[nonot]

Can you imagine paddling across the Colorado on a blow up raft - the Park Rangers would straight jacket you these days!

There are places where this is reasonable and the park has opened up their policy on packrafting. The inflatable mattresses are less desirable, Harvey's best friend died trying to do it with him.

[KwaiChang]

Kwai, read through your log. You have picked a well-travelled route. It will be easy except for your plan to go from Phantom to the north rim, that day will be a bit long and tough for you, so I'd recommend you start early on that day and bring lots of snacks (and eat them often too on that day).

To say nothing of my Ironman hike from the NR to Phantom to the SR in one day

Loads of food stuffs will be along as well as water but the fact that we can load up on the way makes things sooooo much easier. Planning on leaving as soon as breakfast is over on the Phantom to NR hike - and planning to leave about 3:30-4am on the NR to SR hike......should be cool!

[maxpower]

I hiked down the Bright Angel trail yesterday on my way to climbing Battleship Butte, and traction devices were necessary only as far as just below the 1.5 mile house. There is very little snow cover on the rim as well, anywhere from nothing to just a several inches in the shady spots. A lot depends on future storms, but it looks like an early spring is in the cards this year. I am not familiar with north rim conditions, but I would think there wouldn't be a problem in May, due to the south facing exposure on the trail.

[nonot]

Kwai, read through your log. You have picked a well-travelled route. It will be easy except for your plan to go from Phantom to the north rim, that day will be a bit long and tough for you, so I'd recommend you start early on that day and bring lots of snacks (and eat them often too on that day).

To say nothing of my Ironman hike from the NR to Phantom to the SR in one day

Loads of food stuffs will be along as well as water but the fact that we can load up on the way makes things sooooo much easier. Planning on leaving as soon as breakfast is over on the Phantom to NR hike - and planning to leave about 3:30-4am on the NR to SR hike......should be cool!

Oh, I thought you were breaking it up in the middle with another stay at PR...in that case, good luck, that is a lot to bite off for a single day for someone without many triplogs.

[Canyonram]

Kwai, Following up your two-day R2R with a non-stop R2R is really pushing the limits. If you wish to attempt this, you should cross-train and include marathon running in order to gain the aerobic capability for a non-stop trip. There are plenty of marathon runners from around the world who arrive at the Canyon in May to 'bag the Canyon' and do either a R2R or a R2R2R.

Here's a triplog from marathon runner Davy Crockett (yep, his real name) who did the R2R2R in May, 2005. Check out the snowdrifts at the North Rim trailhead and the snow down to the Coconino Point overlook. http://www.crockettclan.org/running/gc.html

Here's a triplog for a dayhike down the SK to the river and back again. This is a fifteen-mile hike and would be similar in distance to your hike from Phantom to the North Rim. Note the training regime: http://www.grandcanyontreks.org/southkaibab.html

An article on getting into shape for backpacking, including suggestions on the type of exercises for Canyon hiking:
( dead link removed )

(Why can I recall these sources and find them with a simple search while my car keys and sunglasses are no where to be found? Why doesn't Google tell me where my car keys are?)

Since no one really knows what you are capable of doing, it's tough to advise one way or the other on your proposed agenda. My guess as to the forum members logging into this thread is that most will keep their mouth shut and honor your ambitions---even if they secretly think that you are being way too ambitious (or crazy). You have the right to push your limits and experience the Canyon in your own fashion. I'm sure John Wesley Powell and his crew had plenty of nay-sayers when he set sail on the Colorado River! Along with that right to challenge yourself is the increased possibility of misery/death. You also have the right and obligation to change your plans when you gather new info, if not for you, for your hiking partner.

My initial reaction was to be blunt and advise you that it was way too much. Then I figured it would be better to just provide you with the needed information so that you are making an informed decision. You will be in very rare company indeed if you can accomplish a R2R2R without any prior hiking or marathon running experience at the Canyon. Please keep that 'ABORT' option handy---if you wake up the morning on the North Rim after your Phantom Ranch to the North Rim hike and can still walk upright and not knuckle-drag to the breakfast buffet you may have a chance. If not, take the TransCanyon shuttle back to the South Rim!

Keep us informed as to your training and then your hike. Walk in Beauty!!!

[KwaiChang]

Canyonram - I appreciate honesty and the advice. Like I said earlier my buddy and I are going to meet up for a week in Key West and will discuss our adventure. The ABORT option is great - if either of us has any doubts we will use it. No shame in it - we know we are biting a huge hunk of meat off the bone - we will see how we do. I have been extremely fortunate to have discovered this site as I have received valuable info from you and others as to what to expect and plan for.

All I can say is there is going to be one hell of a party in the hot tub @ the Holiday Inn on Thursday!!! Getting back to Flag will be a miracle on Friday!! I will be looking for the nearest watering hole and will shack up there for a bit! Sipping some good IPA's and savoring the victory! Then I will fill in my triplog for yours and others amusement as I am bringing my lap top and will need to start uploading images and stories!

I have always believed that fortune favors the prepared. We will be prepared and well trained - if all goes well I will have a hell of a story if all doesn't go well I will still have a hell of a story!!!!

[Canyonram]

Kwai---Sounds like the after-hike celebration party in the hot tub in Flagstaff is going to be as dangerous as anything you are planning to do in the Canyon. Check the 'Charlie Sheen' website for those preparations.

You have the required self-confidence and preparation plan plus the 'ABORT' option. The journey of a 1000 miles begins with the first step and hiking the Canyon begins with that first step below the Rim. One small step for a bighorn, one big step for a backpacker.

I look forward to reading about your successful hike and your list of what worked and what didn't. Keep us posted as your work toward your goal.

[KwaiChang]

Canyonram - hey man - we all have a special talent in life - mine is showing people like Chuck how to party in a hot tub - now I will admit that I do not have 2 goddesses but I do have one and she will be the first to admit that I could show Chuck a few things about drinking. I am here to rapidly partake in your talent about hiking knowledge!!!

[Canyonram]

Kwai,

Forgive me for not checking on 'Private Messages' ---- you are the first to contact me this way and your message has gone unanswered for three weeks! Guess I need some training on how to navigate this website. (I replied to your private message but will post here just in case).

Your training regime looks good---another way to sneak in some work is to buy and wear ankle weights---you can get these is various weights and wear them under your pant legs. Every move becomes a weight-lifting exercise.

The stairs are a good way to mimic the Canyon---it is all downhill to the river and all uphill to the Rim. Depending upon the lenght of your stride, one mile = about 2,000+ steps. So, you can mimic the effort at the Canyon by counting steps and calculating how many trips are needed up-and-down to get at 2,000. Multiply that about 60 miles (your total proposed agenda). Now that you are getting close, take a weekend and walk 25 miles with a loaded pack and the extra ankle weights. Your total trip has you doing about 7+ to Dripping Springs down the Hermit, about 25 on the first R2R and about 25 on the second non-stop R2R. Readjust if you get too beat up doing a practice 25 single day hike.

Hat is a must. You'll be a 7,000 - 8,000 feet for your hike. The thin air allows more UV and sunburn is a major injury suffered when people hit the trail in the Canyon. Remember, UV has nothing to do with air temperature---you can get a bad sunburn in the middle of winter. Hat should cover the ears and shade the face. You can get by with a baseball cap if you put drape a bandana over the top of your head first to cover the back of your neck and over the ears. Sunscreen on the exposed skin---especially the arms and tops of the hands.
For the well-dressed hiker: ( dead link removed )

I'm about 200 miles away from the Canyon---did my first 'hike' at 13 and did everything wrong. LOL. I worked at the Canyon for several years and did a lot of Search-and-Rescue, mentored hikers, and did plenty of hiking of my own. The Canyon is my favorite place --- I liked to see you have that same experience.

The other thing you need to consider is your response to the altitude. The Canyon sits right at that border where people start worrying about high altitude illness. Do a web search and read up on the symptoms. The problem comes in when people hike uphill while they are not yet acclimated to altitude.

Arizona is indeed a great place to go backpacking. I've been doing sections of the Arizona Trail. I'm planning on doing the whole deal next year.

So sorry that your message lay undiscovered for so long!

CanyonRam

[azbackpackr]

CanyonRam, just fyi, that link didn't work correctlly when I clicked on it. Not sure why.

[Canyonram]

Thanks for heads up on the broken link:

http://www.grandcanyonhiker.com

OR in search box type: the dressed desert hiker

Another great website is here (right Liz) : http://www.hitthetrail.com/clothing.php

[Canyonram]

North Rim weather forecast for mid-May 2011. Note snow forecast--no mention of accumulation.

http://www.weatherforyou.com/cgi-bin/hw ... ds,country

Hope the link works!!!

[KwaiChang]

Hi Gary - thanks for the link - I have been obsessively watching the weather on the rims and at Phantom.

I managed to get two days in a row down at Phantom so it will be nice to explore a bit down there - looks like mid 90's !! I am happy for that! Saw there was a bit o snow on the South rim yesterday but it is supposed to be in the 60's come Saturday so that will be nice for my first hike the Dripping Springs calibration hike. Sunday is SK to Phantom, Monday is over to Ribbon Falls with a side step over into Phantom Canyon, Tuesday up the NK to the NR. Wednesday back down the NR to Roaring Springs and back to NR - then the Bataan Death march on Thursday, down NK and up BA. Still trying to get a Wednesday nite stay in Phantom.....that should make things a weeee bit easier!!

Either way - both of us are pumped - we have been training like mad but I know after I get done with that climb out of NK to the NR I am going to be saying to myself - How do you train to hike in the Canyon? HIKE the Canyon!

Looking forward to posting my first official Canyon triplog - will make that Bear Mtn log look puny!!!

Thanks again to all who have given advice via my many posts and put up with my stoopid questions.

Bring.
It.
On!!!

[tibber]

Good luck. Enjoy your journey and your stay. It will be everything you've heard, seen and read about and MORE!

[KwaiChang]

Thanks Tibber - Friday can not get here soon enough I am driving my wife nuts - she wants to take me to the airport now!