Where would you rather live?

[Jim]

I may have asked this before, but I don't remember and can't find it. Still, I'm curious so I will ask again.

Where would you rather live? Where you currently do, or Flagstaff? If neither, where is that?

I live in Flag, yet after todays weather, the high rent I pay, the low wage job I just left today, the really irritating train, and many other things, I would much rather head to warmer and drier towns. I like the middle elevations of 3000' to 5000', especially since the 115 of Phoenix is not a sane temperature to me, and neither are -15 and -8 degrees (last years and this years low temps in Flag).
Still, I'm returning to school for a second BS degree, so I'm stuck here for 3 more years.

How about you?

[azbackpackr]

There are a lot of places I can think of where I might like to live for six months or a year, but not forever.

The first place I will probably go to live for six months will not sound very exciting to most of you. Yuma, Arizona. As some of you know, we tried wintering there once before, had fun, then got into a bad car wreck and had to come home.

It's funny about some places, though. They may have more to offer than what meets the eye at first. Yuma is like that. People drive through it on the freeway on their way to San Diego. They see a big, dusty sprawling town with motels RV parks and lots of green farms. Then they cross the bridge and they're in California. They may see the tiny river below the bridge. (It's very big and wide ABOVE Imperial Dam, but is drained out for agriculture by the time it goes under the bridge.) Anyway, I'm sure Yuma would never be on most people's lists!

Yuma works for me because it has really cheap rent (I still have to pay my mortgage in Eagar, after all), great winter weather if you want warm and dry. You often can sleep with the windows open, and wear shorts and sandals during the day in winter. I have already talked to the kayaking and rock climbing/desert hiking teachers who give classes at the community college. They sound like nice, fun people. There are two bicycle clubs, both of which do road and mtn. biking.

The peak bagging opportunities around there are awesome. In between the peaks there are interesting canyons. There are wilderness areas and wildlife refuges, the lower Colorado River, and lots of Jeep roads everywhere. You can float the lower Colorado for several days, from Blythe to Imperial Dam. (Lots of Scouts do this trip in springtime.) Petroglyph sites, not publicized, are found here and there, you just have to keep asking around.

If you want pine trees you can drive over to the Laguna Mtns. in San Diego county from there--takes about 2 hours to get there. Of course, San Diego is close, too, only about 3 hours.

[JimmyLyding]

I've lived in Tucson for a total of 7 years, and Phoenix for pretty much the rest. I was born-and-raised in Phoenix, and I have more friends and family here in the Valley, but Tucson far surpasses Phoenix in terms of hiking.
You can't get in your car in central Phoenix, and be at 9,000' in an hour like you can from Tucson. The Tucson Mountains are right next to downtown Tucson, and they're basically the McDowells, but bigger and with better trails. There are so many killer hikes within 2 hours of Tucson. It would be hard to find a better place for good all-year hiking, and it's not as if the climate is the only reason. The views are incredible around Tucson, and about every hike has a great payoff.
I went to the U of A from 1993 to 1998, and lived in Tucson from 2005-2007, and I've only scratched the surface of Tucson's hiking amenities despite doing something about every week. Mainly in the latter period because I was in college there in the '90s, but hiking around Tucson kept me sane. It's very cool to be able to hike 5 miles in Pima Canyon after work, or go to Aspen Draw mid-morning and be home before 4 in the afternoon.

[joebartels]

gotta love the ol' Tucson vs. Phoenix debate viewtopic.php?t=990

[Al_HikesAZ]

I would like to visit Tatooine. But for living, I don't think anyplace could beat The Shire.

[big_load]

gotta love the ol' Tucson vs. Phoenix debate viewtopic.php?t=990

I can't remember how (or if) I joined that one, but I'd give Tucson a big edge on hiking, but the traffic can get to me. I like old-fashioned walkable business districts with some people out and about (but not too many), so Flagstaff and Prescott are among my favorites. I like Safford a lot, too, but that might be due to my only visiting on my way to or from a hike.

[azbackpackr]

Despite an affinity for geography, have to admit I have never heard of Tatooine or The Shire (except in The Hobbit). Are we talking literature here?

Tucson has great hiking, no question about it. And very close to town. You can do multiday hikes from the edge of the city into the Catalinas and Rincons very easily. And lots of great swimming holes! I lived there for 13 years myself. Great hiking club, too. I have been a member of it since 1995.

I like Safford, too, but there isn't much there. Not a lot to do in the town itself, other than go to the community college. It has a really neat seasonal kayaking spot called the Gila Box. Plus Mt. Graham, etc. Lots of hot springs around there. I have been told there are about 20 of them. Another good thing about Safford is that, unlike Benson, Kingman, Yuma, Willcox, Flagstaff, or Williams, it is NOT a small town bisected by a big interstate with noisy trucks going at all hours. The interstate is some miles to the south. An interstate does not improve a small town, in my opinion.

[Al_HikesAZ]

Despite an affinity for geography, have to admit I have never heard of Tatooine or The Shire (except in The Hobbit). Are we talking literature here?

More fantasy than literature. Wherever I am, I'm happy.

[azbackpackr]

[Jeffshadows]

Most of our trails down here take you somewhere, which is a huge bonus, too. You usually get some culture, history, or an awesome sight along with your hike.

[azbackpackr]

Most of our trails down here take you somewhere, which is a huge bonus, too. You usually get some culture, history, or an awesome sight along with your hike.

Boy, you really said it. The Forest Service isn't listening, though. They often get grants up here in the White Mtns. and build these silly little recreation trails, spend a LOT of money, and they often don't use volunteers. The newer trails they have built are poorly engineered, poorly maintained (because they are built with grant money and the grant doesn't include any maintenance.) They often don't even FINISH the trails they start--case in point, Murray Basin and Overland Trails in the Springerville District. But they have so many changes in personnel I don't think the current crop of employees even knows those two trails aren't finished. When they were building the Overland Trail they didn't want ANY input from hikers. I know. I tried. Other people tried even harder than I did I gave up after awhile and so did the other people. The Forest Service was going to do what they wanted to do. That trail is wide enough to drive a pickup on, and at one point it has a 26% grade, which is too steep for most bikes and horses.

Overland trail does go somewhere, however--Eagar to Crescent Lake. Murray basin does not. I do like Murray basin, though, because at least it is single track, mostly, and is right next to my town. Overland is very wide, was built with an excavator, and is constantly bootlegged by ATVers.

When I told them they should build a real hikers' trail, that runs from one end of the White Mtns. to the other, or to connect many of the unconnected trails, so we could more easily put together multi-day trips they look at me with this puzzled expression. Why not a thru-hikers trail through the White Mtns? Why is that so weird a concept? Why is it a weird concept for them to build a trail that goes from the White Mtns. to the Gila Wilderness? Why is it a weird concept for them to connect existing trails so you could hike from Flagstaff to the White Mtns?

They're not listening though. They have it all set up so that the individual ranger districts do their own trails, and they are each like their own little domain, and don't pay attention to what the neighboring ranger district is doing. And they change DR's like they were underwear--seems like every time you turn around there's a new DR who doesn't know the area.

Ok, I'm off topic.

[Jeffshadows]

Why not a thru-hikers trail through the White Mtns? Why is that so weird a concept? Why is it a weird concept for them to build a trail that goes from the White Mtns. to the Gila Wilderness? Why is it a weird concept for them to connect existing trails so you could hike from Flagstaff to the White Mtns?

Oh now both of those ideas are completely awesome! Those would draw folks like me out of the Old Pueblo up there, too...

[big_load]

I agree. I'd start planning that trip today.

[snakemarks]

Mexico... Pacific coast.

Seems like all the Mexicans want to be here, and now Mexico is the latest hot spot for US retirees sooo... I propose a citizenship swap. They want to come here and work; we want to go there and play; we exchange passports at the border and everybody's happy, si? Or, maybe we could just sell our citizenships on ebay for a little extra retirement cash.

Before I get all kinds of hate mail, you know I'm kidding, right?

Well, sorda...

[Jeffshadows]

Mexico... Pacific coast.

Seems like all the Mexicans want to be here, and now Mexico is the latest hot spot for US retirees sooo... I propose a citizenship swap. They want to come here and work; we want to go there and play; we exchange passports at the border and everybody's happy, si? Or, maybe we could just sell our citizenships on ebay for a little extra retirement cash.

Before I get all kinds of hate mail, you know I'm kidding, right?

Well, sorda...

If it meant half the snowbirds that infest Tucson every winter would now relocate to Mexico, I'd help you setup the eBay citizenship store!!

[PaleoRob]

I agree. I'd start planning that trip today.

Indeed!

[azbackpackr]

I dunno. I have a friend who works seasonally for the FS up here. For years he had a home in Mexico, I think in Navarit, where he ran jeep tours or some such. After 20 years of it he'd had enough. He says Mexico and the Mexicans themselves have changed too much, and have become infected with a sort of greed mentality that they didn't used to have. He said he probably will never go back there.

[Jeffshadows]

I dunno. I have a friend who works seasonally for the FS up here. For years he had a home in Mexico, I think in Navarit, where he ran jeep tours or some such. After 20 years of it he'd had enough. He says Mexico and the Mexicans themselves have changed too much, and have become infected with a sort of greed mentality that they didn't used to have. He said he probably will never go back there.

I've heard the same thing from a few seasonal Penasco die-hards...

[snakemarks]

He says Mexico and the Mexicans themselves have changed too much, and have become infected with a sort of greed mentality that they didn't used to have. He said he probably will never go back there.

Greed?! How awful! Certainly, America isn't greedy!

[te_wa]

the Mexicans themselves have changed too much, and have become infected with a sort of greed mentality that they didn't used to have.

yeah, its called Capitalism and it is necessary for every developing country. Even if mexico only got to the stage New Zealand enjoys, they'd be doing great (and wouldnt need to come here ;) )

[azbackpackr]

Ok, but I think he meant you get the feeling they all have their hand out.

The one thing that would save Mexico would be a total commitment on the part of the government over the next 20 years to ensure that as many children as possible graduate high school, and also attend trade school or university. This would cost a great deal of money, and would be difficult to enforce in areas where all children in a family are expected to work to provide for the family. It would be worth it, though, in the long run. It would really transform the country. It has been done in several developing countries with some success.