Motorized Electric Bikes On Trails

[SpiderLegs]

Had my first encounter with one of those new motorized E-Bikes on Trail 100 yesterday. Guess the intent of these bikes is to have a small electric motor to "assist" the rider up short, steep sections of trail. The bikes have a max speed of about 20 MPH. I really got ticked off when I saw this guy plowing down the trail on what in my mind is essentially a low powered motorcycle.

Has anyone else bumped into these bikes yet? From the cursory bit of research I've read these bikes exist in a grey area and haven't been banned yet because they are so new to the market.

[rcorfman]

@sidhayes
I really thing this is more about one's expectation than anything else. I rarely have any issues with cyclists on trail, yet others seem to have issues all the time. I see a lot of hikers that go out of their way to cause conflict with cyclists. Are you one of them? I have an extensive back ground in cycling, having raced road for 20 years. At that time, I kept Mt. biking for pleasure. I have used Mt. Biking a lot for geocaching, riding both trails and old mining roads. I'm not sure when I last rode, maybe a couple years ago; my bikes are covered with dust. To put this back on topic, I am against E-bikes on non-motorized trails and I am against bikes in designated wilderness.

[wildwesthikes]

I'm not sure when I last rode, maybe a couple years ago; my bikes are covered with dust. To put this back on topic, I am against E-bikes on non-motorized trails and I am against bikes in designated wilderness.

Same here; exact same story.

I rarely have any issues with cyclists on trail, yet others seem to have issues all the time. I see a lot of hikers that go out of their way to cause conflict with cyclists.

1000% - I hike and run alongside them with severe regularity. Basically daily. 9/10 would share a beer with your average MTB'er.

I've been reading countless threads like one this for at least 15 years on both hiking websites and cycling websites.
They all start like this: "one time this one guy on a bike was nearby me on a trail and they did something dickish so now I think they all suck".

ALSO.

This thread isn't called, "one time I was hiking and I got caught up in a BIKE RACE and I didn't like it".

This thread IS called: "Motorized Electric Bikes On Trails"

Can we please not straw-man this topic to hell in order to prove an unsubstantiated point.

[SpiderLegs]

@rcorfman - My background is that I raced road bikes and at one time managed one of big pro shops in Tucson. Sold all of my bikes when I moved back to Arizona and took up hiking & trail running instead. I've crewed for a team of guys that were doing the AZT 300 bike packing race, have numerous friends that were some of the original mountain bike pioneers in AZ & NM. Cycling isn't my thing anymore, but it is for a huge portion of my friends. My experience is that most cyclists I bump into on the trails are decent, the only two places I tended to have bad encounters have been in South Mountain and on Trail #100 in Phoenix.

Have to admit that I'm biting my tongue when some of my friends are flirting with getting e-bikes. Their 60+ year old knees just can't handle some of the climbs anymore. But I think that e-bikes are a slippery slope to other things on our trails. Last place I want to see them is on the AZT or any other FS trails.

[SpiderLegs]

Hope the link works -https://www.facebook.com/Arizona.Trail. ... __tn__=K-R

But 10 minutes ago the AZT Association put out a statement on the survey. I can only find it on their Facebook page for the time being.

[FOTG]

@SpiderLegs

A graduate student with close ties to the Arizona Trail recognized the issues and the rapidly changing policies that were emerging from federal and state agencies, as well as counties and cities throughout Arizona, and offered to lead research into perceptions of conflict surrounding potential future use of e-bikes on the Arizona Trail.

Oh great some college kid got to decide e bikes should be allowed and called it his thesis. Seriously that statement is garbage and their survey was garbage. As they mentioned in their statement, they knew they were already going to allow them. Then why the hell put out that GD survey,

In five years it will be 25cc and below motors, in ten years dirtbikes, but they must be four stroke, in 15 years they going to be widening the trail for quads...

[LosDosSloFolks]

@friendofThundergod
Using all your previous comments, the survey metrics would likely list you as "undecided"

[joebartels]

https://forums.mtbr.com/attachments/gen ... -clown.jpg

https://www.askideas.com/media/14/Bike- ... -Image.jpg

https://practicalsurvivalist.com/diy-vi ... tructions/

[chumley]

widening the trail for quads

Phew. The Mazzies always break skin and cut deep into mine.

[FOTG]

@LosDosSloFolks
lol that was pretty good!

[FOTG]

@chumley
Quads for days! ha ha

Didn't we once discuss an amnesty day for quads and dirt bikes on AZ trails to clear them out once a year and to reestablish tread? lol

[Alston_Neal]

@friendofThundergod
I've always advocated a one day open season on side by sides and quads, the date to be announced the following day.

[chumley]

I think the poll can be taken down since the results are irrelevant to the decision which has already been made.

[SpiderLegs]

So one tidbit from the AZT statement is that one National Park along the way of the AZT is already allowing e-bikes.

[FOTG]

@SpiderLegs
I think what struck me, was towards the end, when they asked people to be kind to them on social media. You know you made an unpopular decision, when you have to do that,

[CannondaleKid]

But 10 minutes ago the AZT Association put out a statement on the survey. I can only find it on their Facebook page for the time being.

Arizona Trail Association eBike Statement

This part provides a clue as to why this is all-of-a-sudden a priority:

Since the Arizona Trail is designated a non-motorized trail by Congress under the National Trails System Act of 1968, the potential of e-bikes on the AZT has not been an issue. After all, a bicycle with a motor (no matter how small or quiet), is motorized.

However, last year the Secretary of the Interior issued an order for all land managers within the Department of the Interior to formalize their position on e-bikes and encouraged them to be made legal wherever bicycles are currently allowed. This could impact six of the Arizona Trail’s 43 passages. Also, since the Department of Agriculture (US Forest Service – the agency that administers the Arizona National Scenic Trail) often follows recreational management guidelines set forth by the Department of the Interior, it became possible that e-bikes could be allowed on most of the AZT outside designated wilderness areas.

[wildwesthikes]

Maybe I'm dense but if someone is doing a thru-bike of the AZT, how in the heck do they keep the motor charged for more than a few days at a time?

When I make youtube videos of 4+ day hikes it takes a 29,000 mah power bank and a 28 watt solar panel to keep just my camera, headlamp & GPS alive.

[chumley]

@wildwesthikes Bird and Lime will be installing ebikeshare charging stations at 1-mile intervals for the length of the whole trail. Just like they do in cities. It's pure genius.

[SpiderLegs]

@wildwesthikes - My guess it won't be people doing a multi-day journey. It will be cyclists that use the AZT just like most of us do and are on there for one day.

[FOTG]

@wildwesthikes

how in the heck do they keep the motor charged for more than a few days at a time

GE is currently working on an 800 mile extension cord, I read. Plug it in down around Tucson and that should get you to Utah...

[Alston_Neal]

@friendofThundergod
I think you're being fecetious.