The Peralta Stone Maps......

hikeaz · Post by **hikeaz** » Dec 08 2006 3:59 pm

http://www.desertusa.com/ldm-1/peralta.html

PaleoRob · Post by **PaleoRob** » Dec 08 2006 6:58 pm

The Spanish of the map-engravers is pretty bad.

YouTube https://youtube.com/username · Post by **PrestonSands** » Dec 08 2006 9:17 pm

Interesting article. I hadn't heard about the Latin Heart or the Stone Crosses before.

azbackpackr · Post by **azbackpackr** » Dec 09 2006 4:28 am

I read the whole thing, including all the comments. I am just not convinced. I tend to think the stones are (or were) part of a hoax. I just sent snopes.com the link because I found they had no mention at all of the Lost Dutchman Mine on their website. Who knows, maybe they'll look into it?

One thing the link didn't mention is where the original stones are kept? I seem to recall AZ Historical Soc. in Tucson? Anyone know for sure?

To me, all those old stories of the search for the Lost Dutchman Mine are like a morality play, a study of human greed and avarice.

big_load · Post by **big_load** » Dec 09 2006 6:50 pm

azbackpackr wrote: One thing the link didn't mention is where the original stones are kept? I seem to recall AZ Historical Soc. in Tucson? Anyone know for sure?

I saw them in the Mesa Museum, but they may have been cast reproductions.

azbackpackr · Post by **azbackpackr** » Dec 10 2006 5:29 am

Looks like they're at the Phoenix Museum of Mines and Minerals, apparently you have to ask staff to see them:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peralta_Stones
http://www.desertusa.com/mag02/sep/per_stone.html

big_load · Post by **big_load** » Dec 10 2006 1:46 pm

azbackpackr wrote:Looks like they're at the Phoenix Museum of Mines and Minerals, apparently you have to ask staff to see them:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peralta_Stones
http://www.desertusa.com/mag02/sep/per_stone.html

They definitely weren't on display there when I visited a few years ago.

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Dec 17 2006 3:40 pm

Preston Sands wrote:Interesting article. I hadn't heard about the Latin Heart or the Stone Crosses before.

There is a reason for that. Not sure why Jim put them in this article, but it is what it is.

The stone maps are not at the Mines and Mineral Museum anymore. They don't have the security to deal with the originals. I believe they have copies you can see if you ask them. I'll not say where the originals are stored, for security reasons. People are crazy sometimes. Find a lot of that in this Dutchman thing. It's hilarious actually...

hikeaz · Post by **hikeaz** » Mar 08 2007 1:55 pm

http://www.desertusa.com/video_pages/du ... movie.html

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Mar 09 2007 12:25 am

Anyone bought this/seen it?

Native_Phoenix · Post by **Native_Phoenix** » Mar 11 2007 12:04 am

I read an article in Arizona Highways a few years ago about the "LDM"... The Lost Mine itself is a hoax. Jacob Waltz had worked in the mines near Congress (out past Wickenburg) for several years, then disappeared for a period of time and returned to civilization with gold and a story of a mine out in the Supes. Recent mineralogical analysis of the mineral deposits and imperfections in his gold found that they match those of gold found in the mines at Congress- and did not match those of gold found in the Superstitions. Apparently, he had been pocketing a little at a time for years. He then left for a long enough period of time to make his "lost mine" story seem plausible, and came back to cash in.

Anyway...If you found a good vein of gold out there, would you leave a map out where people could stumble upon it and find your mine? I wouldn't make a map at all. But if you did make a map, would you make it out of stone- given that you or your packanimal would have to carry part of it around and therefore necessarily carry less water and essential supplies? A map on some sort of leather would be more portable and easy enough to hide. --and that business about "ancient" roman numerals- why would anyone be using ancient numerical systems in the New World?
It's silly stuff. It's also very sad that so many have wasted so much of their lives on this hoax- time they could have spent with their families, improving themselves, working real jobs...maybe enjoying real life. It's part of our human nature that we are intrigued or even tempted to our downfalls by "arcane secrets", promises of fantastic rewards around one more corner or one more ridge "-if only, if only..."

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Mar 11 2007 6:54 pm

Native_Phoenix wrote: Jacob Waltz had worked in the mines near Congress (out past Wickenburg) for several years, then disappeared for a period of time and returned to civilization with gold and a story of a mine out in the Supes. Recent mineralogical analysis of the mineral deposits and imperfections in his gold found that they match those of gold found in the mines at Congress- and did not match those of gold found in the Superstitions.

Are you talking about the Vulture mine? He worked there, but this ore is NOT from the Vulture mine. He was fired from the Vulture in a high-grading incident though.
Also, where did you hear this? Where can I find more info.

Hoffmaster · Post by **Hoffmaster** » Mar 11 2007 10:22 pm

In response to Native_Phoenix's reply: Where did you hear that Jacob Waltz created the stone maps? I have never heard or read anything to support that.

mttgilbert · Post by **mttgilbert** » Mar 12 2007 7:33 am

Matt Hoffman wrote:In response to Native_Phoenix's reply: Where did you hear that Jacob Waltz created the stone maps? I have never heard or read anything to support that.

I'm with Matt. I've done quite a bit of reading and have never heard that those stone maps were created by Waltz. I thought that most scholars thought the stone maps were to the peralta mines which are possibly distinct from the waltz mine.

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Mar 13 2007 3:01 am

Matt Hoffman wrote:In response to Native_Phoenix's reply: Where did you hear that Jacob Waltz created the stone maps? I have never heard or read anything to support that.

I don't think he was saying that, just talking about 2 different topics in the same post

freeform · Post by **freeform** » Apr 02 2007 12:27 pm

Ive heard the stone tablets were created by the Jesuits before the Spanish really came in to the area. But ive also heard there are a total of 7 mines that could be the Lost Dutchman. Crazy old Charles Crawford claims he is currently working one of these mines.

And just my opinion, Even if the mine is real or not. If someone actually found it, it wouldn’t of been reported. Plus there’s a rumor the City of Gold Canyon founders found a cache of gold and why they were able to make a city. Of coarse its a rumor, but I don’t know of any known "gold canyon" geography in the Sups. that would dictate its name.

Plus, knowing the area and living on the Goldfields. As a professional Lapidary and armature Geologist. Gold can be found in the Sups, its quite possible. Especially around the riff zones of Calderas. Ive also sampled Platinum and tested it for some locals who claim they smelted it out of rocks they mine in the Suppers. Ive also heard many other wild stories about the Supps. Even had a black substance brought to me to have tested which came back as unknown. The stories will come and go. But the Mountains will always be there.

djui5 · Post by **djui5** » Apr 02 2007 3:27 pm

Make that 17 mines!