March '09 Catclaw Revenge Cleanup Tortilla Pass-Angel Basin

[SuperstitionGuy]

:worthy:
March 12th (Thursday) to March 15th (Sunday) - update as of February 4th

Trail maintenance - cutting back the overgrowth with long handled loppers or hand held pruners.
Read the following posts about the project for further information and make comments yourself.

Recommended tools for this project:
Bypass Lopper from Lowe's - 27" long handled model item # 41006 ($16.98) with the silver handles & green grips.
Mini Bypass Pruner from Lowe's - 14.5" long handled Corona Two-Handed Mini Bypass Pruner, BP3225 ($19.98)
Heavy leather gloves with wrist protection combined with a tough long sleeved shirt and tough long pants.
You may also want a hat for sun protection, sun glasses, eye protection goggles and knee pads.

Grasshopper will be responsible for the work project from the Woodbury Trailhead to Tortilla Pass.
I will be responsible for the work project from Angel Basin to Tortilla Pass.
Grasshopper plans to set up a base camp by Byous Butte and car pool each day to the work site.
We willl base camp in Angel Basin and hike/work the trail from the north to the south.
It is not necessary that you be available for all four days as any help will be appreciated.

For those committing to this the Angel Basin base camp, I will be guiding a side excursion to a little known cliff dwelling in Rogers Canyon late Saturday afternoon.

Please commit to either half of the project and let Grasshopper and I know your plans and resources.
We hope to have campfire get togethers in the evenings so it's not all work as well.
Then we can share our hiking and backpacking experiences, stories and lies.

I may even be willing to tell you my story about the burial in the main cliff dwelling of Rogers Canyon.

We would also like to have a volunteer on site that has the emergency device called SPOT in case we have any life threatening injuries while performing this service project. Those of you who have committed or expressed interest please let me know if you have this device. Just PM me...

PS - There will be a full moon this weekend for any of you that wish to backpack in or out in the dark of the night.

Stay tuned for further updates and information.
:thanx:

[rally_toad]

Oh my gosh! After all the pain the catclaw has put us through, the revenge will be sweet and savory! That freaking catclaw on that route just got us yesterday. We might want to take a few more hours and clean up the last part of the JF trail as well. I'm afraid some of the JF trail scars arent going to heal.

[rushthezeppelin]

You should ask the FS if we can also get some revenge on Campaign and West Pinto trails : P I'm sure most of the Eastern Supes could use some cleanup half just for the safety of others who go out there. I know I would never wish mine or Rally's experiences on any other hikers out there, especially BSA groups going through there. Would probably take multiple groups easily a whole season to get all those trails in shape though.

[Dirt4dinner]

I would be down to do some cleanup on that Tortilla Pass area. To be honest, work could be done going either direction on the JF trail from Tortilla Pass. It looks like you are off to a good start by posting here...

[te_wa]

as long as "paramedics" are the guys with the Jack Daniels, Im game. I know you dont drink but i think you can appreciate the need to forget the scarring and pain caused by a day of fighting the Supes' version of physics: "An object in motion tends to stay in motion unless acted upon by catclaw"

[writelots]

Interested, dependent upon schedule. The catclaw wrangling I've done in the past usually involved pretty heavy implements that I'm not sure I'd want to "backpack" with - but heck, I'll try most anything (particularly if te-wa's bringing the Gentleman Jack...)

[rushthezeppelin]

as long as "paramedics" are the guys with the Jack Daniels, Im game. I know you dont drink but i think you can appreciate the need to forget the scarring and pain caused by a day of fighting the Supes' version of physics: "An object in motion tends to stay in motion unless acted upon by catclaw"

Ya I remember when Bonnie from our group was getting through some catclaw and it tripper her. That patch almost took me out too. The manzanita was trying to take me out more though as some of the patches had some really low branches that could trip you. I would never give up hiking poles for the world.

[Sredfield]

You can cut catclaw back but the best thing to do is to grub it out with a pick mattock or Pulaski. Pick/pulaski's are less technical that a pruner, and don't get dull.

FS may know some horse people who would pack the the tools in, or there may be horse people here.

The objectives of the event are 1) Stay safe, 2) Have fun, 3) Do it right, 4) Revenge on the catclaw.

I hope that it is not be the weekend of March 13 or 27.

[rally_toad]

Revenge on catclaw should be the first objective, then stay safe and have fun.

[tibber]

Just give me a set of clippers and I'm good to go. Cutting back/dead heading is my specialty in the garden :budrose: :budrose: , just ask my mother.... on second thot.

Anyway, I would be more than happy to help save you catclaw hikers from a little catclaw. :PMIC: If I'm not going to Rocky Point, I can help. (day hike part)

[drewboy]

I'm game for a trip to wreak revenge on the evil catclaw scourge. After my last couple of beatings, I've been searching the net for a lightweight machete to start bringing along on my supes trips. Anyone found a good source for those?

Any weekend but 3/7 for me - Tewa's got a trip planned that weekend.

[rushthezeppelin]

I have a wally world machete and it never seemed to work well on catclaw.....perhaps I just need to get it super sharp and keep a sharpener with me.

[hikeaz]

It would likely be a good idea to treat any stumps or pruned branches with herbicide - it may provide more prolonged 'relief'. The herbicides triclopyr (e.g. Garlon4® or PathfinderII®) and imazapyr (Arsenal®) can be very effective when used in this fashion. It's likely the USFS has this stuff by the drum.
Tebuthiuron in spray or granulated form is another option. (Trade names of: Spike, Brush Bullet, EL-103, Graslan, Perflan, Herbec, Herbic and Reclaim)

America the Beautiful – National Parks and Federal Recreational Lands Pass – Volunteer Pass - Free.
This pass is for volunteers acquiring 500 service hours on a cumulative basis. It provides access to, and use of, Federal recreation sites that charge an Entrance or Standard Amenity Fee for a year, beginning from the date of award. The pass admits the pass holder and passengers in a non-commercial vehicle at per vehicle fee areas and pass holder + 3 adults, not to exceed 4 adults, at per person fee areas (children under 16 are admitted free). These passes retail @ $80.00 - $80. divided by 500 is about $16 cents per hour.

[SuperstitionGuy]

America the Beautiful – National Parks and Federal Recreational Lands Pass – Volunteer Pass - Free. This pass is for volunteers acquiring 500 service hours on a cumulative basis.

Hey, I already qualify for at least three of these! How do I apply....

Keep the suggestions coming folks on how best to beat the catclaw. I will ask Debbie about killing the roots with some type of chemical.

[rushthezeppelin]

Are these herbicides environmentally safe? I don't want to be spraying anything on these plants that will get into the water table and either hurt other wildlife out there or contaminate our streams.

[rally_toad]

Are these herbicides environmentally safe?

Exactly what I was thinking. I know alot of us drink from the water out there, don't want the rain washing any dangerous herbicides we use down into Roger's Canyon and Angel Basin.

[hikeaz]

Are these herbicides environmentally safe?

Exactly what I was thinking. I know alot of us drink from the water out there, don't want the rain washing any dangerous herbicides we use down into Roger's Canyon and Angel Basin.

They are relatively harmless to animals and in the kinds of quantities that would be necessary for this work, would not be detrimental, long term, to the water supply. Plus, didn't ya ever wonder what all that untested BLOOD that we lose on account of these bushes has been doing to the water supply? :yuck: I don't know where some of you guys have BEEN! :yuck:
When you make an omlette ya sometimes gotta break a few eggs.

Triclopyr- Rapidly hydrolysed in soil and water (with a half-life of less than 1 day) to the parent acid, which undergoes further degradation.
Half-life of the parent acid in soil and water is dependent on conditions and is approximately 6 to 52 days.
ECOTOXICITY
: LC50 (aquatic species)
: 0.1 .. 1 mg/l
This ecological assessment is calculated from data available on the components of the formulation.
Highly toxic to fish (Not necessarily identical to the EC classification risk phrases).
This material is slightly toxic to aquatic invertebrates on an acute basis (10mg/L<LC50 <100mg/L)


Tebuthiuron Acute and chronic RQs for terrestrial wildlife impacted by the typical application rate were all below the most conservative LOC of 0.1 (acute RTE species). At the maximum application rate, three acute exposure scenarios (ingestion of contaminated food by small and large mammalian herbivores and the large avian herbivore) predicted RQs above the most conservative LOC (0.1; acute RTE species). The small mammalian herbivore acute RQ of 1.86 was also above the “acute high risk” LOC of 0.5. Two chronic exposure scenarios (ingestion of contaminated food by the smaller large mammalian herbivores) were above the chronic LOC of 1, with an RQ of 3.58 and 3.79, respectively at the maximum application rate. These results indicate that direct spray impacts are not likely to pose a risk to terrestrial animals at the typical application rate. Acute and chronic risk to avian and mammalian herbivores is predicted at the maximum application rate.
Acute and chronic toxicity RQs for fish, and acute toxicity RQs for aquatic invertebrates were below the most conservative LOC of 0.05 (acute RTE species), indicating that direct spray impacts are not likely to pose acute or chronic risk to fish or acute risk to aquatic invertebrates in the pond or stream.

From the USFS"For several decades, research has been conducted on the fate of for citry-use herbicides in various watersheds throughout the southern and western United States, Canada, and Australia. This rescearch has evaluated chemicals such as 2,4-D,glyphosate, hexazinone, imazapyr, metsulfuron methyl, picloram, sulfometuronmethyl,tebuthiuron, and triclopyr. Losses in strcamflow, and leaching to groundwater have been evaluated. Field study data indicate that residue concentrations tend to be low. except where direct applications are made to ephemeral channels or streams, and do not persist for extended periods of time. Regional environmental impact statements in the United States demonstrate that forestly herbicide presence in surface and groundwater is not a significant risk to water quality or human health."

[Sredfield]

just use a pick mattock and grub them out,

[rushthezeppelin]

just use a pick mattock and grub them out,

Ya I would rather do it this way as well. It also yields immediate results

[hikeaz]

just use a pick mattock and grub them out,

Might have good results if done right...but it appears that a herbicide is still necessary.....
From oracletown

"Mimosa biuncifera, known as Cat-Claw Mimosa or the Wait-A-Minute Bush, is one of the most difficult desert plants to eradicate. Ordinary cutting and digging has no effect.

This plant can be identified by the slightly zig-zag shape of its branches and the double-hooked claws at each elbow of a zig-zag. It grows to about five foot tall and can easily become an impenetrable thicket through seeding.

The following eradication steps will work most of the time:
Dig out the root nodule which lies 6" to one foot below the ground.
Grab and pull up each of the underground roots attached to the root nodule.
Backfill with dirt so that the root ends are forced to stay exposed above ground.
Paint the exposed root ends with "Green Light Cut Vine and Stump Killer" or any herbicide containing triclopyr acid.
Leave the root ends exposed to the sun and dry winds for 3 to 6 months.
If you leave any root underground, the plant will grow back."