7/12/10 - Yet another report of missing hikers in the Supes

[hippiepunkpirate]

azcentral.com - 7/12/10 - 2:51PM:

Three hikers have been missing for nearly a week after setting out to find the Lost Dutchman Gold Mine in the rugged Superstition Mountains east of Mesa, Maricopa County Sheriff's deputies said Monday.

Family members last heard from the three Utah residents Tuesday, when they left to search for the legendary treasure, Sheriff's spokesman Jeffrey Sprong said.

However, when family members had not heard from the three men, they contacted the sheriff's office, which began its search Sunday.

Family members told deputies that Kurtis Merworth, 49, Ardean Charles, 66, and Malcom Meeks, 41, planned on exploring the area during the day and spending the nights in a local motel. Sprong said that probably means the hikers did not have camping provisions.

Two of the men reportedly have medical conditions, and it is not known if they have their medications with them, Sprong said.

Their vehicle was located in the parking lot and according to Sprong, the car appeared to have been there for a few days.

Helicopters monitored the area Sunday, and a rescue team and volunteers were sent to search on horseback Monday. According to Sprong, the rescue teams, which were forced to take breaks in the excessive heat, had not found any clues.

Rescue teams were sent to find Merworth last year when he became lost on another hike to find the Lost Dutchman's gold, Sprong said. No other information regarding his rescue was available.

Sounds like they're done for.

[Tough_Boots]

Oh, come on, surely they will find 3 guys, even if they have passed away...

I guess that depends on who's searching. Unless they're within a few miles of the TH and extremely close to a trail, I think they'll be out there until some hiker stumbles on a really awful scene when it cools down a bit. Right now you've got forest service and law enforcement back there on horseback which means they're only covering the trails and probably taking lots of breaks to keep their horses from keeling over. If a helicopter could spot them, it would have by now.

I'll tell you what-- if I'm that unlucky hiker that finds them in a wash out on Bull Pass, I'll never want to hike up Black Top Mesa again...

[Alston_Neal]

viewtopic.php?f=66&t=4740

Thanks for the link. Good thing it's slow at the gallery today, I could read the whole thread.

Good group of folks on this forum.

[Jeffshadows]

Oh, come on, surely they will find 3 guys, even if they have passed away...

I guess that depends on who's searching. Unless they're within a few miles of the TH and extremely close to a trail, I think they'll be out there until some hiker stumbles on a really awful scene when it cools down a bit. Right now you've got forest service and law enforcement back there on horseback which means they're only covering the trails and probably taking lots of breaks to keep their horses from keeling over. If a helicopter could spot them, it would have by now.

I'll tell you what-- if I'm that unlucky hiker that finds them in a wash out on Bull Pass, I'll never want to hike up Black Top Mesa again...

Birds generally only spot people who want to be found and are making themselves really easy to spot (Big, smoky fire, mirror, etc.) Unless they have military-grade imaging...

[Al_HikesAZ]

Birds generally only spot people who want to be found and are making themselves really easy to spot (Big, smoky fire, mirror, etc.) Unless they have military-grade imaging...

From what I understand, the Phoenix PD, MCSO and DPS Helos all have FLIR - Forward Looking Infrared Radar. So if there is an anomalous heat signature they will spot it. A couple of the pilots told me that they can see the illuminated screen of a cellphone from almost 8klicks. If your cellphone has juice, it will actually work better than a signal mirror. Cody Lundin in his book 98.6degrees - The Art of Keeping your pumpkin Alive teaches that the best survival skill is knowing how to help searchers find you. Exact opposite of SERE training. If these three aren't underground, I would expect the vultures to be circling.

[BobP]

A couple of the pilots told me that they can see the illuminated screen of a cellphone from almost 8klicks. If your cellphone has juice, it will actually work better than a signal mirror.

Thats cool

[SuperstitionGuy]

Al_hikesAZ said, "Cody Lundin in his book 98.6 degrees - The Art of Keeping your pumpkin Alive teaches that the best survival skill is knowing how to help searchers find you. Exact opposite of SERE training." What the....

SERE is an acronym used in relation to two related military training programs:
The United Kingdom's Survive, Evade, Resist, Extract training
The United States's Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape training

Thanks to Wikipedia.....

[Al_HikesAZ]

SERE is an acronym . . .Thanks to Wikipedia.....

Sorry. I have been so immersed in some of this jargon that it's sometimes hard to realize that most people don't know the jargon. YEP - Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape. Cody's premise of helping the searchers find you is the best paradigm for "survival skills" here in Arizona. It would be rare to need the evasion skills.

Isn't Wikipedia great (most of the time)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survival,_ ... and_Escape

The curriculum has three key parts: survival and evasion; resistance and escape; and water survival; some parts are classified.

Survival and evasion
Most of SERE training focuses on survival and evasion. Skills taught include woodcraft, and wilderness survival in all types of climate. This includes what is known as emergency first aid, a variant of the battlefield variety, land navigation, camouflage techniques, methods of evasion, communication protocols and how to make improvised tools.

Resistance and escape
Training on how to survive and resist the enemy in the event of capture is largely based on the experiences of past US and allied prisoners of war. Most of this aspect of the course is secret. Several official websites, however, give a general overview. Official sources insist that SERE students are not themselves taught how to apply coercive techniques, but are taught how to resist them if captured.

The Resistance Part is the really scary part - that's where our Military learns what it's like to be waterboarded among other enhanced interrogation techniques.

Here is another great acronym: SURVIVAL

The U.S. Army Survival Manual uses the word survival as a memory device to get the important principles firmly in your thinking:
S - Size Up The Situation (Your condition, tools, surroundings)
U - Use All Your Senses, Undue Haste Makes Waste
R -Remember Where You Are
V - Vanquish Fear and Panic
I - Improvise
V - Value Living
A - Act Like the Natives
L - Live by your Wits, But for Now, Learn Basic Skills
You may not be able to "vanquish fear," but that's okay. Panic, on the other hand, is not okay, so vanquish that at least.
To "value living" seems a given, but many people in survival situations get discouraged and lose the will to live. There are ways to regain it. They include talking about the future, if you are with others, and imagining the people you love that are waiting for you.

The other great acronym is STOP

acronym S.T.O.P. Sit -Think - Observe - Plan.
SIT: When you realize that you are lost take the time to sit down and collect your thoughts. You are not lost, you are right where you are, your camp, vehicle and everyone else is lost.
THINK: What do I have at my disposal both physical and mental that can help me in this situation. Take an inventory of your survival kit items and how you will use them. Take an inventory of your mind, remember what you always thought you would do if you got lost. Most of all remain positive, you will survive.
OBSERVE: Look around, is there shelter, water, high ground, an open area so the searchers can see you. It will be easier for those searching to find you if you can stay in one selected location that will allow you to build a fire, provide shelter, set out signals and be in an area that can be seen at a distance or from aircraft .
PLAN: Now create your plan of action. Be positive and take care of yourself. If it is late in the day, build a fire for heat and signaling, find or make a shelter against the weather, and most of all remain positive, you do have the ability to survive. You have conquered the major danger of not allowing panic to cast your fate, you can now conquer anything else that confronts you.

The other trick is to always have a 99Zulu to hike with.

[azbackpackr]

i keep googling to see if there is any new info on the search effort, but there has not been much at all.

[joebartels]

A couple of the pilots told me that they can see the illuminated screen of a cellphone from almost 8klicks. If your cellphone has juice, it will actually work better than a signal mirror.

Thats cool

Bob is on his cell phone more than any teenager I've ever met, so this is good news for him.

[Al_HikesAZ]

A couple of the pilots told me that they can see the illuminated screen of a cellphone from almost 8klicks. If your cellphone has juice, it will actually work better than a signal mirror.

Thats cool

Bob is on his cell phone more than any teenager I've ever met, so this is good news for him.

As long as it's not the Black Ops Helicopters that are surveilling him They can be so far away that you don't even know you are being watched.

[suzaz]

I did just get a lengthy email from one on my SAR friends that is involved in the search describing the portions of the search he has been involved in and vaguely what they have and have not found in the car and during the search. I should probably not mention much more here at this point....but it does revolve around "prospectors" and critically poor choices, IMHO. Most members of these SAR teams are volunteers trying to balance their search efforts with their jobs, sounds like there is not much sleep going on. The heat is crazy, everyone is exhausted. They have set up wilderness water stations for the crews and helicopters are moving people all over the place. They are taking a break tonight and efforts will resume in the morning. He did say, "I have seen plenty of water back there, so IF they were experienced outdoorsmen, they could sustain themselves – but I have serious doubts about their experience in the outdoors. Especially in our unforgiving terrain and heat…"

Sending positive thoughts to the missing hikers, their families and our search teams.

[azbackpackr]

That is what I have been thinking, that the rescuers must be really exhausted. I feel very bad for the 3 guys, but sheesh...

[Jeffshadows]

SERE is not all fun and games out in the woods like wikipedia thinks, I'll just say that...

[Jeffshadows]

I did just get a lengthy email from one on my SAR friends that is involved in the search describing the portions of the search he has been involved in and vaguely what they have and have not found in the car and during the search. I should probably not mention much more here at this point....but it does revolve around "prospectors" and critically poor choices, IMHO.

I'm sorry to be a stick-in-the-mud, but this is silly. The work that a volunteer SAR group is engaged in is not classified or law enforcement sensitive. If the attitude is that they are deliberately withholding details from the public, they need to get over themselves...

[nonot]

Well, yes and no.

Within the first days of a search gathering vital information from the scene will be of value to the search party, particularly the tracker(s). However, once the trackers have had their chance, there is little value in keeping secrets unless foul play is involved for later criminal prosecution.

From what I've observed, both Maricopa and Sheriff's rescue have their heads up their pumpkin in terms of searching this year. The missed motorcycler 300 ft from Peralta TH, the failure to find Jesse Capen (and deliberately withholding information months after he went missing), and the failure to find 3 guys who wandered in from first water TH without much water.

While its admirable people are volunteering to search, and I can't say that the sheriff's people who are getting paid to search in the heat have that great of a job right now, but I really wonder about the leadership of both these organizations. Maybe they should abandoned searching entirely and take up politics on both sides badmouthing the others in the newspapers some more...that's been really effective so far this year. :roll:

Oh, and FLIR is not effective in the desert during the day, only at night once the ground cools off. So if these guys huddled down during the night underneath something, then there isn't much technology can improve as far as odds of finding them. Don't think your cell phone is more valuable than it is, a small lighter can start a campfire just as easily and draw searchers in like moths to a flame.

These areas of the Supes are bland and unforgiving, both where Jesse went missing and these guys hiked in. Thinking there is someone out there protecting their find is laughable. An insane man killing people randomly is more likely, but having travelled near these areas plenty of times, I've seen no evidence that would suggest that type of activity was taking place over the last few years. The overwhelming possibility is this is simply Darwinism at work picking off the weak and unprepared. I expect bodies will be found once the temps cool down and people hit these areas hiking in the late fall. I'm a bit surprised the vultures and not clueing the searchers in, but vultures probably are smart enough to be avoiding the heat as well.

[Jeffshadows]

We can agree to disagree on the subject.

I think you're right about the rest of it, though...

[PaleoRob]

The Supes Killer?

[Jeffshadows]

I found a picture of the killer. I doubt anyone will be surprised:

[PaleoRob]

That's why he hasn't posted anything in here!

[te_wa]

ok, i dunnit.
but, i must say, that photo was taken in the morning - i look much better just after sunset