Water jugs NOT to cache

Bob Lacourse · Post by **Bob Lacourse** » Mar 02 2015 9:24 am

I just received a email from Brakeman and grasshopper about water jugs that are cached on the trail by thru hikers and are found empty when the hikers retrieve them.

The jugs that leak have a seam across the bottom and continues up the sides. The email also suggest that opaque plastic containers also leak. Milk jugs are a good example of jugs that will leak.

The only water jugs that DO NOT LEAK are clear jugs that have a noticeable indentation at bottom center that projects upward into the jug. These jugs have a seam at the center of the container.

Anyone who has cached water on any trail for your future thru hike, using the jugs with seams at the bottom should go back and change out your cache prior to your start date.

I apologize for not posting the actual email I received. I am not computer literate and have no idea how to do that.
If you want the email please send me a personal email at boblacourse@hotmail.com and I will forward the scientific study to you.

joebartels · Post by **joebartels** » Mar 02 2015 9:49 am

Should be sufficient. So the clear ones do not have a seam on the sides?

Copy & paste on desktops/laptops should you need it is very handy.
- left click your mouse
- drag over text to highlight
- let go of left mouse button
- hover over highlighted text
- right click
- select "copy"
- now right click where every you want to put it and select "paste"

Tablets are a bit tricker, basically tap and hold. Google should help with specific devices.

outdoor_lover · Post by **outdoor_lover** » Mar 02 2015 1:24 pm

Milk Jugs suck...But I've found that the Arizona Ice Tea Jugs work great...Not that I've ever Cached any, but I freeze them and use them for Ice Blocks in my Cooler and they never leak and split...They are thicker, without Seams....

SuperstitionGuy · Post by **SuperstitionGuy** » Mar 02 2015 2:25 pm

What do the illegal boarder crossers use?

They must have learned by know what is best!

azbackpackr · Post by **azbackpackr** » Mar 02 2015 3:08 pm

SuperstitionGuy wrote:What do the illegal boarder crossers use?
They must have learned by know what is best!

They don't cache them. They just carry them and discard when empty.

te_wa · Post by **te_wa** » Mar 02 2015 4:11 pm

these look nice: beerpouch.com however i cannot find a dealer..
i was researching the idea for different beverages, but for water i found the pre-made margarita packages are great. roll up or fold flat, and don't weigh near as much as a water jug.

cactuscat · Post by **cactuscat** » Mar 02 2015 4:45 pm

@te-wa
Maybe ... but you have to drink pre-made margaritas to empty them! :yuck:

Sredfield · Post by **Sredfield** » Mar 02 2015 5:58 pm

I hope all the cache 'ers do go back and retrieve the empties they placed and used along the trail. With the increasing use, they are becoming noticeable, and pretty nasty to clean up after they get so old and break into a gazillion pieces.

te_wa · Post by **te_wa** » Mar 02 2015 6:24 pm

kelli, i do not condone such practices. that's Agave blasphemy!

mazatzal · Post by **mazatzal** » Mar 02 2015 9:09 pm

@Sredfield
Excellent advice Shawn. My friend Jim and I saw some cache trash along Black Hills last March. I know you and the crew did that section recently, did you see much or was it mostly cleared? I hope so.

blisterfree · Post by **blisterfree** » Mar 02 2015 11:21 pm

Outside of the established cache boxes, why cache at all? There's plenty of water out there for a desert clime. Especially this season. Let's not turn the Arizona Trail into the PCT in southern California. We're better than that.

CannondaleKid · Post by **CannondaleKid** » Mar 03 2015 6:23 am

blisterfree wrote:Outside of the established cache boxes, why cache at all?

If that means I won't be providing caches for public use in areas between cache boxes I'm sure that will make at least somebody happy at the cost of someone else running out of water.

Yes, it would be nice to have more cache boxes, and it would be nice if everyone was always prepared by having enough water at all times, but does that mean stop caching?

My 2 cents... sorry, the View more smilies isn't working at the moment.

chumley · Post by **chumley** » Mar 03 2015 7:49 am

A basic rule is that clear plastic is a much more durable substrate than opaque plastic. Clear plastic bottles include 2-liter soda bottles, sports-drink bottles, and the bottles that grape or apple juice are packaged in (among other flavors).

But is there any source that actually bottles a gallon of water in more durable containers at the "factory"? All that I'm aware of come in the cheap milk carton plastic. Even the larger 2-3 gallon "fridge" water containers are cheap plastic.

I think there's convenience in buying sealed containers to cache rather than refilling other more durable containers. Are there any suggestions on where water can be found in better containers?

joebartels · Post by **joebartels** » Mar 03 2015 7:55 am

Perhaps just have a barrel of water or a mini tank so to speak. It could be covered and underground. Hikers don't need Crystal Geyser and should be carrying a means to filter anyhow.

Bob Lacourse · Post by **Bob Lacourse** » Mar 03 2015 8:39 am

I would hope that hikers who do cache water bring there containers out with them and dispose in the proper receptacles at parking lots or in towns
We all have to practice Leave No trace, to preserve the beauty of all trails.

blisterfree · Post by **blisterfree** » Mar 03 2015 12:37 pm

The problem with caching out in the open at random places along a national scenic trail is that it becomes part of the trail's culture after a while, and just continues to grow exponentially until the trail corridor takes on the aura of a race event, post-race and pre-clean-up. As Shawn mentioned, plastic jugs which aren't recovered in fairly short order will (if they haven't already leaked dry or been wrongfully claimed by others) UV-degrade into a million pieces and become that much harder to pack out. It just doesn't pass cost-benefit analysis, much of the time, not the least for the one relying on said cache. And as certain trail angels along the CDT in New Mexico would attest who liked to cache en masse for thru-hikers, leaving water bottles on public land without approval can be a chargeable offense. That's how Smokey sees it anyway.

blisterfree · Post by **blisterfree** » Mar 03 2015 12:42 pm

"Are there any suggestions on where water can be found in better containers?""

Good question! I found this, starting with a reliable spring in a bathtub:

http://www.fredgaudetphotography.com/az ... urrent.pdf

:bigth:

rcorfman · Post by **rcorfman** » Mar 11 2015 11:47 am

This really shouldn't be a problem if the water is cached following a couple rules:

Cache the water as close to when needed as practical. It takes time for the containers to degrade, so don't give the time for that to happen.
The Arizona sun hastens container degradation so cache the container where the sun don't shine.

The_Eagle · Post by **The_Eagle** » Mar 11 2015 12:04 pm

rcorfman wrote:so cache the container where the sun don't shine.

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