FR 487

[joebartels]

Good news!

Young, AZ (May13, 2008) -- Workman Creek (Forest Road 487) which had been closed for repairs, is now open to the public.

[big_load]

The notice makes no explanation. But the attempted stabilization of the roadway and "bridge" (I use that term loosely) just below the falls may be a potential culprit.

They completely overhauled the bridge below the falls not all that long ago. The bridge/culvert higher up appear less robust as I recall. The stretch of road going up from the lower bridge seems quite vulnerable to erosion and regardless how solid the bridge is could wash out pretty badly.

[PrestonSands]

I think the closure up to Aztec Peak itself (above the falls at least) may have to do with a new travel management plan that shows 487 crossing into the Sierra Ancha Wilderness near the peak.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/nfs/11558/www/n ... 099289.pdf

[chumley]

@PrestonSands
I think that's likely coming, but the closure now isn't near the wilderness boundary and it is set to expire in two years, which makes one wonder.

[nonot]

The last time the forest service closed the road to Aztec peak was a washout and landslide at the bridge. It read nearly identical to the notice above (closed 1/4 mile below the falls).

The most logical reason for the new closure is bridge damage or erosion at the bridge.

I seem to remember it took them almost 2 years last time to fix the bridge damage and repair the erosion, but maybe it just felt that long.

[chumley]

maybe it just felt that long

I raise you FR95

[00blackout]

Apparently a pretty large sinkhole has opened up on the road and the FS is not sure what to do with it. I guess two years gives them an excuse to do nothing with it for awhile.

[FOTG]

That bridge and the little spot leading up to it is literally in the best shape I have ever seen it, I swear it almost looked like it had been recently graded before the bridge. You could get a Prius to Workman right now, this is most likely just more incompetence spewing from the Tonto Clown Factory. lol I spoke to someone there today who encouraged me to call Tonto in Payson, I guess nobody can get a straight answer, he has been calling them for awhile now. They seem to go back and forth between the road is closed for safety and the road “may” be in a wilderness area and closed forever he says. I’m sure they will tell me it’s closed for Covid when I give them a ring tomorrow. lol

Also for the record, the closing of that bridge will only improve the wilderness beyond there, but Tonto owes it to outdoor community to say what exactly is going on. I will give a call tomorrow to inquire some. I mean for example, do they have a plan to maintain the trails past the bridge anymore? (not that they did before) Maybe they have a publicly available engineers report or road survey they did when they deemed the road unsafe? They also told the person I met today that they applied for federal money to fix the bridge. Do they have a publicly available draft of that application? What are the estimated costs of repairs? What is the exact problem that makes that bridge unsafe now? Can anyone working for Tonto name one trailhead beyond that bridge? I have lots of questions. lol

[nonot]

Did you venture past the bridge or find the sinkhole that was reported above? Last time I was up there there was significant erosion damage on the road about a quarter mile past the bridge.

[Grasshopper]

Did you venture past the bridge or find the sinkhole that was reported above? Last time I was up there there was significant erosion damage on the road about a quarter mile past the bridge.

@friendofThundergod
So is the gate on FR487 at the Falls Day Use Area [ photo ] presently closed and locked?

[FOTG]

@Grasshopper All the day use areas appear to be open along the creek to the gate. The gate is closed about a quarter mile from the falls.

@nonot
I think I know where you are talking about, but we turned around at the falls. I did not observe any damage up road from that spot.

I really am going to give the office a call tomorrow up there and see exactly what’s up. I mean if it’s a wilderness boundary issue, so be it Wilderness wins, but if we are waiting around two years on some mythical bridge repairs because some ranger who gets outside once a year now deems the bridge unsafe, that’s a different story. lol

Edit: I had a better pic FYI, anyone who has driven over that bridge, knows it’s been awhile since the road looked that good right there.

[FOTG]

I called Tonto this morning. I did not really get any new information, but it was a productive chat. I was told kind of the same thing, there are two factors at work here, the bridge area and the erosion around the bridge in particular, has been deemed unsafe. It does sound like the Murphy Ranch property owner still has access, but it was determined by engineers that reducing the traffic on that bridge and the areas around it was the best way to preserve the road while they wait for funding to fix, which they have applied for. It was kind of interesting, because she told me that with the recent rains, the area around the bridge had probably been washed out by now anyways, but I did let them know just in case they have not been out recently that its in great shape.

The person on the phone was very nice and professional. She told me that I made some good points and she was going to push up some of my points to their public information officer and they may be releasing some more formal and informative information on the closure soon. She did let me know that they have been getting several calls from people concerned about the loss of access to that area. She acknowledged that additional information should probably be released to the public, so the closure does not seem so arbitrary.

Some points I brought up to her included: the amount of Ancha Wilderness that is now essentially inaccessible without 5 plus mile RT road walks just to reach TH. I also asked about trail maintenance and she agreed its something that should be addressed as well. She also made a comment about those trails probably not getting much maintenance anyways, which made me chuckle a little. I just reminded them that closing the road meant more than a loss of access for the ATV and hunting crowds and there was a robust system of trails that is not pretty inconvenient to reach among other things.

I tend to be a little snarky about Tonto, but they answered all of my questions to the best of their ability and I believe she was being truthful, so I am satisfied. It does not sit well with me that the property owner at Murphy now essentially gets his own 5-10k acre private plot of public land to play on for the next two years, but alas you can't fight city hall.

TLDR: Road isn't opening anytime soon, but they are listening.

[DixieFlyer]

@friendofThundergod
I drove up to the top of Aztec Peak on FR487 back in April, and I thought that the area just after the falls was in much better shape than in prior years...of course that isn't saying a whole lot...lol...I felt like I really didn't need 4WD

[RedRoxx44]

It is interesting how things evolve depending on the bureaucracy involved. A couple of deceased prominent Globe ranchers/ et al rebuilt that bridge years ago when it washed out, I am sure with no one's permission. The one gentleman though was a renowned machinist, he machined some large load bearing parts for the Roosevelt bridge so it was no shoddy pumpkin job. They assisted the rancher up there at the time.

Then there was/ is the "bridge" made by 4 wheelers up in the Panamints on the Pleasant Canyon/ Chicken Rock loop, now part of Death Valley Nat'l Park. There was no code for that and they allowed traffic on it for years, closed it for a while and now open again and I think it's been upgraded, but not by the park, once again.

And ranchers can make access a problem in Az if they want. The crazy lady who gated the Klondyke road and stopped access to the East side of Aravaipa; that went on for many months. Rancher who gated access to Skeleton Canyon, even the Border Patrol and Forest Service I talked to seemed to be able to do nothing, despite the area beyond totally public land. The Galiuros' Powers Hill is now closed, but was open and closed before that. At one time access beyond Muleshoe on the southern end to Redfield canyon area was closed for years; you had to carry your backpack on the old road the 10-12 miles to get to Jackson cabin.

Old Rumor had it the guy running Tonto wanted to totally limit access to Cherry Creek area to ranchers and anyone else. The plan was to close Cherry Creek road because it is mostly in the Wilderness area although there is some dispute in the mapping.

[chumley]

@RedRoxx44
Speaking of Tonto ... add the narrows to that list of locals creating issues that the FS can't (or won't) deal with.

[chumley]

@friendofThundergod They posted the following publicly on their facebooks.

The wash out on Road 487, below Workman Creek Falls, has caused erosion around the bridge area. The erosion has passed some of the road barriers, causing a safety concern, the engineering staff have tried several fixes to the road but none of the fixes have held. Based on feedback from our engineers, minimizing traffic on the road will extend the life of the bridge until a permanent solution can be made. Because it is the only road to access the Aztec Peak Lookout, private property continued access is imperative. Motorized access is only allowed for Forest Service emergency and administrative use and to private landowners. Motorized use on the road is the only thing prohibited, members of the public are still allowed to hike, mountain bike, horseback, or use other non-motorized means to access the area.

[FOTG]

I give some credit to Tonto for the transparency and putting this information out there and they were great when I chatted with them Monday.

However, this situation is starting to resemble some of the things going on in wilderness areas across the West. The public is losing access to huge chunks of wilderness due to the declining nature and neglect of forest roads by the FS and a lack of enforcements of legally binding easement agreements with private property owners etc. One article I read, mentioned some examples in Montana of ranchers essentially now controlling huge tracts of public lands due fo closed forest roads and interfering in traditional and legally bound easements and access points to wilderness.

I am going to go out on a limb and assume the forest service knows this road will never be repaired and in 20 years nobody will remember the days when the road was open. And now no matter how you cut it, a private property owner now has exclusive rights to a huge percentage of the Sierra Ancha Wilderness. They also now have their own publicly maintained, several mile long driveway too.

And just to review the facts, the road showed zero damage after the most intense rain event this state has seen in nearly a quarter century. But according to the FS it’s too dangerous for us regular bums to use, but just safe enough for them and the private property owner at the end of the road. Oh Lordy I would love to read that publicly available road/engineering survey they surely completed to determine all of this.

[ShatteredArm]

I actually wouldn't be too upset if the road doesn't reopen for awhile. It was really nice being able to stroll around up there last weekend with no traffic. The road is necessary to connect a few of those trails together, and while I usually hate having to walk or jog on forest roads, it's not too bad when there aren't any vehicles.

[Grasshopper]

I actually wouldn't be too upset if the road doesn't reopen for awhile. It was really nice being able to stroll around up there last weekend with no traffic. The road is necessary to connect a few of those trails together, and while I usually hate having to walk or jog on forest roads, it's not too bad when there aren't any vehicles.

Just get it all done while you are now 38+ because when you are 75+, believe me, you would rather drive that extra few miles to the designated TH Starts

[sidhayes]

Grasshopper Really?

[ShatteredArm]

@Grasshopper
I know 70-year-olds who are faster than I am, and can go farther than I can.